Author Topic: A fresh pair of eyes ...  (Read 3210 times)

Offline mezentia

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A fresh pair of eyes ...
« on: Friday 12 May 06 08:53 BST (UK) »
I have a problem with my wife’s great grandparents. I’ve been looking at this so closely for the past weeks that maybe a fresh pair of eyes can spot something I’ve missed.

The couple in question are Felix Beach (or Bache) and Phebe Attwood.

Felix was born in 1837 in Halesowen, then in Shropshire. He can be tracked through the census returns:

1841 HO107/908/6 Folio 47 Page 22 Birmingham Street Halesowen
1851 HO107/2034 Folio 307 Page 10 Great Cornbow, Halesowen, age 13 occupation Labourer
1861 RG9/2062  Folio 66 Page 10, Lodger with Sidaway and Family, occupation Carter
1871 RG10/2995 Folio 10 Page 14  Lodger with Susannah Hodgkiss and family, occupation Labourer
1881 RG11/2884 Folio 97 Page 51 44 Lumbans Bank, Cradley, occupation Carter.

Felix died on 26 April 1881 of Capilliary Bronchitis and Exhaustion. The informant was Betsy (Elizabeth) Wood (nee Attwood), his sister-in-law, who was present at the time of death. (Attwood is mis-transcribed on Ancestry.com as Allwood on some census transcriptions.)

Felix had three children:

Benjamin, born 1871
Felix, born 20 May 1872
George, born 1880

Benjamin appears on the following census returns:

1871 RG10/2994 Folio 119 Page 8
1881 RG11/2862 Folio 110 Page 11
1901 RG13/2762 Folio 110 Page 9

Benjamin was christened by his parents on 6 May 1871 at St Peters, Cradley, but appears to have lived with his grandparents and adopted their surname.

Felix junior and George can be found on the following census returns:

1881 RG11/2882 Folio 97 Page 51
1901 RG13/2733 Folio 65 Page 28

Following their father’s death, Felix junior and George lived with their grandparents, James Attwood and Esther (nee Hampton). Three months after Esther died in 1885, James re-married Harriet Smith (nee Morris), a widow. After James’ death in 1897, Felix and George continued to live with Harriet. On this basis, I assume George was Phebe’s son.

I have a copy of the original of Felix junior’s birth certificate that states:

30 May 1872 Tyes Green, Rowley Regis
Felix Beach
Mother Phebe Beach formerly Attwood
Father’s name and occupation Felix Beach, Carter
Registered by Phebe Beach (she made her mark) on 20 June 1872

The problems I could do with some help with are mainly with Felix senior’s wife (?) Phebe.

1.   There is no record on the birth index for Phebe that I can find for either spelling – Phebe or Phoebe. Successive census returns all place her year of birth as 1850 – 1851, but I've looked +/- 10 years either side.
2.   There is no marriage entry for Phebe or Felix that I can find. However, since Phebe’s parents didn’t marry until 1883, some 17 years after their last child was born, living “over the brush” seemed to be the thing to do. So, did Felix marry Phebe, or did she follow her parent’s example?
3.   There is no death entry for Phebe that I can find. On the basis that George is Phebe’s son, and that she didn’t appear on the 1881 census, did she die between giving birth to George on 1880 and the date of the 1881 census? As her sister Betsy was with Felix when he died, is it correct to assume that Phebe was already dead when Felix died?
4.   Given that George was born some 9 years after Felix junior, were there other children who didn’t survive?
5.   Should I assume that George was Phebe’s son, and if not, could Phebe have married someone else, being an alternative reason I can’t find a death registration? If George wasn’t Phebe’s son, who was his mother?
6.   Where is George’s birth registration entry? On the basis that Phebe registered Felix junior, why wouldn’t she also register George?
7.   Is George a Beach, a Bache, an Attwood, or something else entirely?
8.   What happened to George after 1901?

Because of the Black Country accent, Beach is frequently mis-transcribed as Bache, the “bee” sound being pronounced as “bay” (or since they were all illiterate, same letters, different order   :) )

Is there any way of getting birth, marriage, and death certificate details without coughing up 7 quid each time to the GRO so that I don’t spend a fortune on wrong certificates in trying to track down any other children that might have been born to Felix and Phebe?

Any help or observations will be gratefully received.

David
Anderson - Leics., Yorks.; Attwood - Worcs., Staffs.,  Salop; Baylis - Worcs.; Beach/Bache - Worcs., Staffs., Salop; Bills - Devon, Worcs.<br />Dovey - Worcs., Staff., Salop; Gill - Worcs.; Hampton - Worcs., Staffs.; Hancox/Hancocks - Worcs., Staffs.<br />Hill - Worcs., Staffs., Salop; Sherwood - Worcs., Staffs.; Stonyer - Worcs., Staff., Salop, Essex<br />Woodall - Worcs., Staffs.; Potter - Essex.

Offline DMP

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Re: A fresh pair of eyes ...
« Reply #1 on: Friday 12 May 06 12:32 BST (UK) »
could this be George?
West Midlands Birth indexes for the years: 1880
Surname   Forename(s)   Sub-District   Registers At   Reference
BACHE   George   Halesowen   Dudley    HAL/042/407
http://www.bmsgh.org/wmbmd/

Donna
Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline DMP

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Re: A fresh pair of eyes ...
« Reply #2 on: Friday 12 May 06 12:35 BST (UK) »
West Midlands Birth indexes for the years: 1849
Surname   Forename(s)   Sub-District   Registers At   Reference
ATTWOOD   Phoebe   Halesowen   Dudley    HAL/009/32
Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline mezentia

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Re: A fresh pair of eyes ...
« Reply #3 on: Friday 12 May 06 13:43 BST (UK) »
Thanks Donna, they might well be. Odd they are listed under Halesowen, tho'.

Since posting my original message, I've discovered two possible birth index entries: one for Phoebe on Ancestry.com as *Abel  Attwood :o - 1849 JAS Stourbridge 18 465 (Image on ancestry.com very, very, faint), and the GRO for George is 1880 JFM Stourbridge 6c 161.

David
Anderson - Leics., Yorks.; Attwood - Worcs., Staffs.,  Salop; Baylis - Worcs.; Beach/Bache - Worcs., Staffs., Salop; Bills - Devon, Worcs.<br />Dovey - Worcs., Staff., Salop; Gill - Worcs.; Hampton - Worcs., Staffs.; Hancox/Hancocks - Worcs., Staffs.<br />Hill - Worcs., Staffs., Salop; Sherwood - Worcs., Staffs.; Stonyer - Worcs., Staff., Salop, Essex<br />Woodall - Worcs., Staffs.; Potter - Essex.