Confused!

[Burto]

Hi,
just got my GGGGrandparents' marriage certificate and it says:
Richard Matthews underage (which apparently means 14?) father Samuel Matthews a Maltster, living at Sear Street.
Eliza Turton correct age Bella Gate father Job Turton.
They got married on 1st June 1856 at St. Mary's.
Now Richard has put on Census things he was born in 1838, but I can't find anything about when he was actually born! Can anyone help find his baptism?
I think I found the right father on the 1841 census:
Samuel born abt. 1806 wife Ann. They had a four year old Richard and that Samuel was a maltster too!!!
I have found a baptism for 28/05/1837 for a Richard to a Samuel Matthews Maltster and mother Ann, but why would they think Richard was underage when he got married? Would it be possible for Richard 1837 to have died and they named a new son born around 1842 Richard?
Can anyone find them on the 1851?
Many thanks.

[Necromancer]

Under age means under 21.

Where is St Marys - which town in Notts  - Nottingham itself ?

[Burto]

Ah that makes sense then...wonder why woman at records office said under 14?
Eliza was 21 so that would make sense. The parish is St. Mary's Nottingham, near Sneinton.

[Necromancer]

14 - or I think it was 12 actually, was the minimum legal age for marriage. Under 21 needed parents consent, but of course people lied !

I may have your family, Ann widowed - a Lace Embroider ? Does that gell ?

No, sorry - the son Richard is 19, giving a Dob of 1832 ....

[Burto]

Hmm not sure then. Unless it means that he was under 21 so he needed his parents consent (he would have been 18 if my sums are correct)? Eliza didn't as she was 21?

[Burto]

I think I've found them on the 1851:
Living at Sear Street (on marriage certificate)
Ann 41 Head Lace Embroiderer
Richard 19
Mary and Richard Seymore who lived there are also mentioned on marriage certificate. I think Mary was Richard's sister.
My problem now is why is Richard 19 on here?! He should be 14!!!

[Necromancer]

thats the one I mentioned earlier - at first I thought it was 14, but comparing with other digits in the handwriting its deffo 19 !

[Jane Eden]

Hi Burto

Just to fill in a few details:

Baptism:
Richard Matthews to Samuel & Ann 28.5.1837 Maltster Crown Yard, off Long Row St Marys

Baptism:
Samuel Matthews to Thomas & Millicent 10.1.1808 St Marys

Marriage:
Samuel Matthews & Ann Dewey 29.9.1827 St Marys

Baptism:
Eliza Turton to Job & Ann 28.6.1835 FWK Silverwood St St Marys

1841 Census:

Samuel 35
Ann 38
Mary 12
William 10
Sarah 6
Richard 4
Henry 2
Selina 3 mths

Crown Yard, off Long Row


1851 Census: I'm not happy with this one but cannot find any other entry. I have looked! Not sure this is the same family. Just thought could they be in the workhouse? The ages and children are not right.

Ann 41
Richard 14 Lacemaker
Emma  ?
William 10

Dean St, Bellar Gate

By the way St Marys is a huge church and parish in Nottingham city centre. It is where they have the civic services and for the start of the Law terms/Crown Court services. I used to ring the bells there a few years ago. There were of course other churches in the city centre, St Peters, St Pauls, St Nicholas.

Jane

[Burto]

Thanks Jane...a massive help confirming names!
I found the 1851 entry on Ancestry and Samuel isn't mentioned on there. He was also deceased when Richard married and the address was correct so it must be them.
I'm struggling to find anything on Samuel's father, Thomas's parents...in particular his father as I'd like to study the Matthews' line...can anyone do a look up please?
If Samuel was Baptised in 1808 then they must have got married around that time but I can't find anything.
Once again thanks for your help Jane!