Please!! Need Help

[Children]

Hi All,

I need help to locate my Father-in law "Charles Edward Hargreaves" who was born in Staffordshire and apparently served in WW1.

Knowing that my father-in law served in the Australian Army durning WW2 I searched the Aust National Archives military records I found a record of him on a "Attention Form for persons voluntarily enlisted in the Milty forces", which he enlisted on the 03 Dec 1935.

One of the questions asked on that form was; had he served in any other Military.
He answered yes and stated that he was enlisted in November 1914 in the Royal Tank Corp, Service N0 7872434 until December 1918.
I noticed that he lied about his age and birth making himself 2 years older. His actual birth is 02 Dec 1902.

Now for the fun part................. I had a look at the National UK Archives military records for WW1 to search for Charles but I came a little but disillusioned as there were a number of service men going by the name C. Hargreaves I couldn;t find any of these with the Tank Corp or service number that he quoted.

Could some one please have a look for me, what he actually did, where he went and did he recieved any medals?

I will look forward to any replies

Kind regards
Wendy

[easy12]

Hi Children,
                 I didn't think that the Royal Tank Corp was formed until at least a year later, either 1915 or 1916.
easy12

[O1dgobbo]

Hi Wendy

Your father-in-law would still have been 15 on Armistice Day 1918.  Although some very young men manged to enlist and served at the front I think the War Office realised that this was a presentatonal problem if the boys were injured or killed.  They took steps to prevent the deployment of such young soldiers in the war zone.  I think that it is unlikely that he enlisted  and if he did enlist it is unlikely that he was posted to a war zone and qualified for any of the campaign medals.

He may have enlisted after his sixteenth birthday or perhaps (if they existed at that time) before in one of the Boy Soldier Regiments.  If he did enlist during the war as a young teenager and was one of the C Hargreaves, whose records you have found, you may be able to identify him from his home address and civilian trade, if those are listed.  Do you have a pre-war address for him?

All the best

Gobbo

[mmm45]

The Service number you have isnt Great War (they were 4  5or 6 digits) Tank Corps became Royal in 1923.
Its possible he served in one of the Training Regiments but never deployed overseas until after the war thus no MIC.

You could try the MOD records for post war service with that number and his name they may have them but they arent online youll have to apply by letter.

[Children]

Hi Gobbo & mmm45,

I do not know what my father inlaw did for his occupation while he lived in Staffordshire Eng and the last known address was on his birth certificate which stated Foden Street Newcastle Under Lyme.

Charles died in Tasmania when my husband was 7 years old, so unfortunately it has been an up hill climb to find out information on him.

I don't believe he would of lied about enlisting in the British Army on the "Attention form for Voluntarily enlistment" that he wrote on in Aust but there is a big chance of him getting his service number wrong.

From the information that I have collect already of him, Charles seems to get mixed up............ like mothers name of his first marriage certificate. He had her down as Mary Louisa (sisters name) not Sarah Lousia.

I will keep on looking and hope that something will turn up.

Regards
Wendy

[O1dgobbo]

Hi Wendy

In Nov 1914 your Charles was not yet 12 years old.  Given standards of nourishment pre-1914 I do not think that he could pass himself off as anything but a boy, however, he might have been able to pass himself off as 14 years old.

There is a reference to the enlistment of boys at about this time.  They  were allowed to serve in non-combatant roles, mostly as bandsmen but a few as clerks, tailors and other base support functions.  See

http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.uk/index.php?title=Enlistment_of_Boy_Soldiers_in_the_British_Army%2C_1795-1959

I have no idea what military training was like in 1914 but forty years later we were expected to remember our eight digit number accurately by the end of the first week of training and woe betide the unhappy soldier who could not do this.  Almost fifty more years on I have not forgotten mine and I do not think that Charles would have forgotten his if he had the same sort of training.

If his Mother was known in the family by her second name Louisa and he knew that his sister was named after his mother he may well have thought that his mother was called Mary Louisa.

I think that the suggestion by mmm45 of a letter to MOD records might be your best way forwards.

Good luck

Gobbo

[mmm45]

MOD request info should be here

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,154824.0.html

Good luck

[km1971]

Hi Wendy

I have to agree that the chances of him serving in WW1 is pretty slim, and as already stated he would have needed to serve abroad in order to receive medals.

The seven-digit service numbers were only introduced in the 1920s, which with the use of the term Royal before Tank Corps as well, suggests he served after WW1. If so, his records are still with the MOD and you will have to apply to them.

Ancestry have supposed to have published online all surviving service records for men with surnames beginning “H”, for men who served in WW1 and left before the end of 1920, so unless he is already on that site, applying to the MOD appears your only option. Ancestry appears to be "down" at present, so I cannot check it.

Ken

[Joyful]

Hi wendy

I have checked A****try and can't see him unless I missed him. there is no doubt the service no you gave has too many digits for active service WW1.

Joyful