Census look up appreciated 1841

[aus_kate]

Would appreciate a census look up for
Charles Jones born about 1819 Herefordshire 1841 Census

He was in Australia 1847

Regards
Kate

[AMBLY]

Hi Kate

Problem 1: 1841 Census ages were rounded down to the nearest multiple of 5.
(So we should be looking for a Charles JONES age 20-23 in the Census)

Problem 2: Places of birth were not stated. If he was in England in 1841, he would state yes or no to being born in the county he was enumerated in. If he was in Herefordshire : "Yes". If he was not:  "No".

In Herefordshire 1841, there are these 5 possibles, all born Herefordshire:
Charles JONES in Bromyard, b abt 1821 - age 20. He's a male servant to a Publican named Thomas LEWIS.
Charles JONES in Kinton, Leintwardine, b abt 1819 - age 22 still in Kinton 1851 and married. He is the son of Price JONES & Charlotte ROBINSON.
Charles JONES in Pembridge, b abt 1822 - age 19, Son of Thomas and Mary 1841, looks like married and still in herefordsh.1851
Charles JONES in St John the Baptist, Hereford City b abt 1821, age 20. He's a plumber. (probable) parents Thomas & Mary and still there in 1851
Charles JONES in Wormesley, b abt 1821, age 20 Already married with an 8mth old in 1841. Still there in 1851

Have you any more clues at all, Australia side? Names of his children maybe? Is there already confirmation he arrived in Australia after the 1841 Census and before 1847? His occupation?

Of the 5 Charles JONES I found  in Herefordshire who are enumerated as born in that county, and who seem to be the "right' age - only one is not found in 1851.  And that's as much to do with the fact there isn't much to identify him in the 1841. Also remembering his actual age could be as old as 24, if 20 is a rounded age:

Charles JONES in Bromyard, b abt 1821 - age 20. Male servant to a Publican named Thomas LEWIS

A Charles JONES did marry in Bromyard Reg District in 1845 (freeBMD)


Cheers
AMBLY

Added:

[aus_kate]

Hi Ambly
His son  James Jones was born in 1847 in NSW Australia.
He was married after that so only assume he wasnt married in Herefordshire

Does the census records have other peoples names listed?
Unfortunately his official records in Australia only state place of birth Herefordshire so can only assume he was born there.

The names in the Jones family that are used quite a bit for first and middle names are James and Melville

Regards
Kate

[AMBLY]

Hi Kate

Just been googling around and see there has been a long search for your chap...

There are names of other persons on the 1841 census - but 2 things:
Relationships are not stated, though the way a household is listed can often help. Middle names were not recorded (and in fact the enumerators were expressley instructed not to record any middle name).

For reference I have found the wife & children of Charles (by wife Elizabeth TEAKLE whom he married in 1848)
 James Melville Jones b: 1847 in Jacqua, Nsw, Australia c: 1852 in Christ Church, Castlemaine, Victoria
 George Jones b: Abt 1850 in Castlemaine, Victoria, Australia c: 1852 in Christ Church
 Harriet Jones b: Abt 1852 in Castlemaine, Victoria, Australia c: 1852 in Christ Church
 Charles Jones b: 1854 in Moorabbin, Victoria, Australia
 Francis John Jones b: 1855 in Moorabbin, Victoria, Australia
 Sophia Augusta Jones b: 1858 in Moorabbin, Victoria, Australia

His wife's parents are named:
Father: John Teakle b: Abt 1796 in Horsley?, Gloucestershire?, England
Mother: Sophia Augusta Gillman b: 1792 in Horsley?, Gloucestershire, England c: 11th Nov 1792 in Horsley

I also found this message set:
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/AUS-VIC/2007-05/1178611842
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/AUS-VIC/2007-05/1178615643

Where the reply was re: a death in Victoria Australia:
Surname: JONES
Given Names: Charles
Event: D
Spouse Surname/Father: U
Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Christian
Age: 56
Sex:
Birth Place: WALE
Death Place:
Year: 1875
Reg Number: 5367
Denomination:
Parish:
Fiche:

Is that the death record of your Charles?
In what other records does his age estimate a y.o.b of 1819?
In what records does the p.o.b. Herefordshire appear?
What was his occupation?

The other matter is his immigration - I take it there is no indication that he wasn't already in Australia by 1841?

Cheers
AMBLY

[aus_kate]

Hello again
Thanks for your efforts but I had all the information you have found appart from the census records
Have not been able to find the ship he arrived on so only have that his son James was born in 1847.
This James is my connection. As you will note James and 2 siblings were all baptised on same day

Interesting that only 1 Charles Jones fits but still may not be him

The name Melville is used as a first name in the family so assume Melville surname is connected to Charles Jones.


Regards
Kate

[AMBLY]

Hi Kate 

yes, I realised you do have all that information.   Once I googled, I realised there was a lot more information....I was trying to work thru it for clues - for as you suggest, there may be clues in the naming of the children (besides James Melville).

For instance, his death record - says his mother's name is Christian, that he was born in Wales. neither of which was contained in your query here - but which may be vital clues.  Christian  was not a common name in England or Wales  for a woman, though it was very common in Scotland.

The fact that it's 1841 we're looking at, that he may be born in Wales but identify with Herefordshire, that  finding a Charles  JONES who just as easily could be living in or born in Wales as Herefordshire, who is gone from the uK before 1851 is not ever going to be easy.

The census I worked thru - they are the most likely in Herefordshire, given a birth of 1819. And all but one end up being found in 1851 so cannot be yours.  There is only one left who is not with any obvious family, his age may be rounded down from as much as 24 to 20, he may have married in 1845. Unless your Charles is the one in Hertfordshire Ledbury in 1841 who is stated as NOT born in herefordshire - it's looking more like your Charles was either in Wales or one of the other English counties in 1841 - if he was still in the UK at all.

All the questions I ask, but which remain unanswered -   what was his occupation etc  - are going to be pondered over & asked by almost everyone who helps look for him.

There were Charles JONES'  which arrived in Port Philip in 1841 I think, have they been checked out?
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/indexes-online/indexes-online#immigration-and-shipping

Cheers
AMBLY

[aus_kate]

Hello Ambly
Sorry I realise I didnt add this info  before. I havent done research on Charles for a while and all my previous info was on my old computer but re the death cert. It has been transcribed not correctly at the link. I have the death cert

Charles Jones Miner died 5th May 1875  Alexandra Vic
Father  Jones Christian name not known
Mother Christian name not known maiden surname not known
Where born  Said to be illegible of Wales  ( I have Herefordshire on his childs birth cert)
His son was the informant

So it leads to the next step

His son James was born at Jacqua NSW 1847 so Charles either arrived in Vic and went to NSW or arrived at NSW

I remember I looked at the two for Vic but couldnt confirm he is one of them.

The one left on the census maybe the one to pursue or eliminate

Regards
Kate

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