Author Topic: Help  (Read 4346 times)

Offline deb usa

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Re: Help
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:18 BST (UK) »
Hi

Thanks for that Jorose

On IGI all of the Black children have been christened on the same date. Parents: John Black and Susannah Richings

20 JUN 1875 Loxley Congregational, Bradfield, Yorkshire
*Susan
*Sarah Ann
*Henry
*Herbert

I can't find a marriage, Actually I can't find marriages to John Black or George Wormwell...does this mean that Charles is still alive?

will look further

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ayr

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Re: Help
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:31 BST (UK) »
Hi everyone.

In the 1901 census for Saddleworth  Susannah Richings is down as the Head but also classed as a widow.There is a son Harry Black aged 26; a grandson Harold aged 9.  Then there is George Wormwell a widower and boarder and also Martha Wormwell  daughter aged 9.  It is the same Susannah as she was born in Fullwood, Yorkshire in 1935.
This is really a mystery I seem to be unravelling; all to find out who my great great great grandparents were and what happened to my great great grandfather Charles.

Keep digging!!

Offline jorose

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Re: Help
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:42 BST (UK) »
Quite a tangle, aren't they!

I would guess given the gaps in the spacing of the children that around the time Esther was born (or maybe a bit before), Charles did a runner. As she couldn't prove he had died, and he had been away for less than seven years when she got together with John Black, they don't seem to have married (after seven years with no word from him she would have been free to legally remarry on the assumption that he was either deceased or had abandoned her).

It's possible that she had the various children christened together in 1875 because John had left and she was receiving some sort of support from someone connected with the church. Or she might have converted (this was a nonconformist church).  John died or left her sometime before the 1881 census, but I can't find a death in the area for him either.

George Wormwell was previously married! To an Elizabeth, who I think is still around in Saddleworth in 1881, listing herself as "unmarried", with a "border", John Davies.  They appear to have had no children, so it's hard to know when they separated.



The Charles who died in 1901 Swindon is the same one on the 1881 census (I've edited my earlier message as I seem to have accidentally added t's into the surname where they shouldn't be), who went by Richings and also Richens.  His earliest child was b. East Hendred, Berkshire, according to 1901 ("Hendred", according to 1881), and may be Charles Edward W. Richens registered in Wantage in 1870.  There is a Charles Edward W. Richings who married in Cricklade district in 1896 who might be the same one (although he doesn't use his middle names on the censuses).

I think he might be hanging about Swindon in 1871:
RG10/1883 32/55
Charles Richens, stone mason (lodger), 30, b. Cirencester, unmarried, lodging with a family by the surname of Ellis.

I simply cannot find Martha or the first child Charles (Edward W?) Richings on the 1871 census.

You might find something about them in the Sheffield Archives - for example, you could ask them what records they hold for Loxley Congregational. There might be some extra notes on the children's christening records regarding the fathers as it must have been a wee bit unusual - six kids at once, and two fathers, at least one of whom appears to have done a runner and the other who she never seems to have married.

http://www.1911census.co.uk/search/tnaform.aspx
 - I think Susannah is listed in Oldham in 1911 as Richings, along with Martha Wormwell and Harold Black.
George Wormwell seems to have died there in 1904.

Meanwhile, Charles' possible second "wife" (no marriage, unless they're the Charles Richens and Martha Jennet Lovelock who married in 1896), Martha Richings is still in Swindon with a couple of her kids in 1911.
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline deb usa

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Re: Help
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:45 BST (UK) »
Hi :)

Following on from Jorose's 1881 find of Charles (age out slightly) with Martha


In 1891
Swindon, Wiltshire
Charles Richings head 60 (b 1831) mar, gen lab b Gloucestershire CIRENCESTER
Martha wife 38 B Chosely, Berks
Martha dau 18 b Swindon
John son 14 b ditto
Julia dau 11 b ditto
Arthur son 7 b Ditto
Mary A dau 5 b Swindon
Ernest son 1 b ditto

Can't find his marriage either ..... so it looks possible that they went onto have other families ...

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline avm228

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Re: Help
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:52 BST (UK) »
For the sake of completeness, I have been looking at an English-born Charles Richings who appears with wife "Elisa H." and children in the 1881 Canadian (Ontario) census (he's enumerated as a 52 yr old builder).

However, I think he can be safely eliminated, as the family (wife more usually being "Eliza") is in Wayne Co, Michigan in both the 1860 and 1870 US censuses.  Children's birthplaces/birthdates suggest an emigration between 1857 and 1860, so too early to be your Charles doing a runner :).

(Likely marriage for this couple is Charles Richings/Eliza Ann Haines Dec 1855 Wantage 2c 678)

Anna :)
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline deb usa

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Re: Help
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 13:54 BST (UK) »
In 1901 they are all still in Swindon... older children married and living next door to Charles (66) and Martha.

RG13/1906 157 18

What death reg do you have for Charles in 1901 ...is it after the 1901 census as taken?

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline deb usa

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Re: Help
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 14:09 BST (UK) »
Looking for the children's birth registration to see if there is a clue to Martha's maiden name

Swindon reg district = Highworth


John Richens Jun 1877  Highworth
Julia Richens Jun q 1880 Highworth, Wiltshire 
Arthur Henry Richings Mar q 1884 Highworth 
Mary Ann Richings Mar q 1887  Highworth

no clues yet

deb 
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline deb usa

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Re: Help
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 14:17 BST (UK) »
If we could find Charles' marriage to Martha ... we could confirm his dad.

where is Chosely? Berkshire ... this is where Martha says she was born.

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ayr

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Re: Help
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 12 May 09 15:14 BST (UK) »
The death I have found is on freebmd.  It's for a Charles Richings in the Sept. qtr. of 1901 (so after the 1901 census was taken) in Swindon.