James Edward Spain

[nelwild]

Hello,

im really struggling with this one.

James Edward Spains birth is registered in Thanet sept quart 1871.

He appears on 1881 census with his parents and siblings.

I can find no trace of him on 1891/1901.

The first death i can find for a James Edward Spain is in Bridge sept 1902 aged 31.

I can also see two marriages for a James Edward Spain:

march quart 1895 Thanet.

James Edward Spain
William Moore Marshall
Elizabeth Ellen Crockford
Emma Luckhurst

On 1891 theres an Emma Luckhurst born 1872 Kingsdown living in Margate,and the 1901 shows she married William Moore Marshall,so this James married Elizabeth Crockford.

Elizabeth Ellen Crockford is on 1871/1881 born 1870 Canterbury,on 1891 working as a servant in Margate.No sign of an Elizabeth Crockford/Spain on 1901.

A search of 1911 shows an Elizabeth Spain born 1870 Canterbury in Thanet.Cant . as my subs expired.

I can see two deaths for an Elizabeth Spain on FreeBMD:

june 1931 thanet

march 1847 bridge

There is a second marriage in Thanet june 1902:

James Edward Spain
Lewis Petts
Celia Hogbin
Rosetta Shersby

Earlier census show Celia Hogbin born 1869 Ramsgate working as a servant in Margate,1911 shows a Celia Petts born 1868 Kent in Thanet,so i think she married Lewis Petts.

That leaves Rosetta Shersby born 1877 Minster,working as a servant in Margate on 1891.
1911 shows Rosetta Spain born 1877 Kent in Reigate.

There is a death in Surrey southeastern 1946 aged 69,which would tie in excactly with an 1877 birthdate.So if the 1902 death was him,she was a widow for 44 years.

There are 3 James Spains on 1911:

James born 1869 Kent in Chertsey
James E born 1867 in Wandsworth
James Wells Spain born 1871 Kent in Thanet.

If anyone can take me any further with this id be really grateful,

Thanks,

Nel.

[kerry1212]

there is a james edwrd spain born 1948 margate kent in 1901 but he is in the thanet union workhouse? any relation?

kerry

[kerry1212]

there is another with john and frances jarvis says he is their nephew he is with a kate spain and james spain aged 1?

kerry

[nelwild]

Hello Kerry,

thanks for the replies.

Im not sure at the moment whether James born 1848 is anything to do with me.I can see him on the 1901 but cant see anything definate before that.
The one born 1871 Shadoxhurst is not connected as ive made contact with a couple of people on GenesReunited who have him.

Mine was born 1871 Ramsgate,son of John Thomas Spain and Mary Ann(Dobson).He appears on 1871:

class RG11 piece 985 folio 21 page 24.

I cant find him after that,and the soonest death i can find is the one in Bridge 1902 age 31,so thats is spot on.

Then theres the two marriages ive found.

I have noticed on 1901 a James Spain born 1877 Bramley? in Cottage Hospital,Reigate.
There is a James born 1877 Wingham on 1891,living Minster,Thanet.
Im wondering if Rosetta born 1877 married him,as shes in Reigate on 1911.Her death is registered in Surrey in 1946.

So that might eliminate Rosetta,leaving Elizabeth Crockford.But where are they on 1901?They cant have gone far if the 1902 death in Bridge is correct.

This is really puzzling me.

Any further help appreciated,

Nel.

[casalguidi]

1891

2 Wheatley Place, Margate

John T SPAIN head mar 54 bricklayer's lab b.Margate
Mary A wife 52 charwoman b.Margate
Elizabeth A dau 23 laundrymaid b.Margate
James E son 19 bricklayer's lab b.Ramsgate
Edward G son 10 b.Margate
Edward T grandson 4 b.Minster
Violet R grandau  2 b.Minster
Clara A grandau 7m b.Margate

RG12/726 folio 74 page 19
.............

With deaths in the Bridge registration district I always think of the asylum at Chartham as a possibility.  There is a "J S" of about the correct age there in 1901 but no birthplace give so not much help

Richard Crockford SPAIN bp Margate 19 May 1898 son of James Edward and Elizabeth Ellen which would confirm, I think, the marriage to Elizabeth Ellen CROCKFORD.  Unfortunately Richard dies before the 1901 census so no help there.

Casalguidi

[nelwild]

Thanks Casalguidi,

i too always think of the asylum when i find a death for someone from elsewhere registered in Bridge.Ive found more than one ancestor who died there.Do you know if its possible to view on line a record of people who died in the asylum?

Thanks for Richard as well,as you say it at least confirms his wife was Elizabeth.

Nel.

[peejayess]

Hi Nel,

I realise that it is over a year since the last reply on this but I have just looked at James Edward Spain and although he unfortunately is not in my "Spain line" the following may be of interest.

I think the James Edward Spain referred to in a previous post in the Thanet Union Workhouse may be your James. This is a transcription from the 1901 census for the Isle Of Thanet Union Workhouse, Minster Thanet

RG13 Piece: 819 Folio: 127 Page: 5



SPAIN, James Edward Inmate   Married age 33    Bricklayers Labourer born Margate, Kent. This is quite close to the birthdate of 1871.

I too have the marriage as:
Marriage to Elizabeth Ellen Crockford
Margate, Kent, England. Church of St John the Baptist
KFHS PR's Vol:14. Entry 2800 Mar 10 1895 By: Bns SPAIN (X) James Edward (24) Ba (Lab) of 2 Wheatley Place, Margate (S of) John Thomas (Lab) CROCKFORD Elizabeth Ellen (24) Sp () of 2 Wheatley Pl, Margate (D of) Richard Bellard (dec) (Carpenter) Witnessed by: George Cain, Susan Setterfield.

I have the following as his parents:
KFHS PR's Vol 14: 1058 Aug 14 1859 By: Bns
SPAIN John Thomas (23) Ba (Labourer) of High St (S of) John (Labourer)
DAPSON Mary Ann (20) Sp () of High St (D of) Daniel (Labourer)
Witnessed by: Louisa Elisa Jarmin, George Cain,

I also do not have any death dates for either James or Elizabeth.

Hope this is of interest,

Regards

Pete Spain
(Ramsgate, Kent, England)