Looking for a place of birth - Morris

[delta208]

My 2 x GGmother is recorded on her marriage certificate as being Annie Morris, from this document I have been able to ascertain her approximate year of birth (1863) and the name of her father (William recorded as an Engine Driver).

Unfortunately the only other record that I have been able to find is her death certificate (1901).

The time line is

Birth 1863

Marriage to Thomas Howarth: 1885, 25 May, Age: 22 at Farnham, England, United Kingdom

Death:  1901, Age: 38, Newcastle upon Tyne Workhouse

Her place of residence on the marriage certificate is just recorded as "Aldershot"

The reason for a lack of post marriage census is that Thomas was in the army and according to family stories they were in India.

They had 2 children:

Thomas James, b1886 in Aldershot
Polly, b1895 in Newcastle upon Tyne

If anyone can help identify her place of birth and any other pre-marriage information I would be so grateful, I have been looking for the last couple of years to no avail.

Simon

[ScouseBoy]

Consider that an Engine Driver may live in a town such as Swindon or Crewe and try a census search in 1861 for an Engine Driver with that name.

[Sandymc47]

Hi
Had a look for you and wondered if this is William?

census 1871
William Morris aged 29 Engine Fitter at works born Warwickshire b c 1842
Mary                        24 born West Brom, Staffs
Thomas      aged 2                     "     "
(cant read boys name) aged 1      "        "

but no Annie.

When I looked on the 1871 census for her I did find a
Annie Morris born Staffs but she was up in Newcastle?
So maybe she was visiting relatives or of course it might
not be her.
Hope this helps and not hinders you and hope you
find your information soon
regards Sandymc

[ScouseBoy]

There is a Newcastle in Staffordshire.  Newcastle under Lyme

[Sandymc47]

Of course there is Scouseboy, must have had a Senior moment.
I will have a look at her again as she could stilll have been visiting
her relatives or was too much for her Mum already having two children
in 2 years.
Will try again and let you know Delta
regards
Sandymc

[mshrmh]

How about this for Annie on the 1901?

RG13 4766 62 2 in Newcastle upon Tyne - Annie Howard is a 38yo married lodger, born Blackpool described as "Army Reservist's wife" - also a lodger 5 yo Mary Howard, born Newcastle (Polly can be a pet name for Mary).

There don't appear to be any corresponding births in the Fylde registration district in 1860/1865 for an A* Morris (or phonetic equivalent) other than an  Andrew), so either this wasn't her birth name/place or she was one of the estimated 10% or so that wasn't registered.

[delta208]

Hi All,

Thanks for your suggestions, I have done some digging given revised family rumours of a Welsh connection and have identified the following family as having potential:

1871 Census

Name:   Anna Morris
Age:   7
Estimated birth year:   abt 1864
Relation:   Daughter
Father's name:   William Morris  - Engine Fitter
Mother's name:   Eliza Morris
Gender:   Female
Where born:   St Georges, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish:   St Philip and St Jacob

1881 Census

Name:   Annie Morris
Age:   18
Estimated birth year:   abt 1863
Relation:   Servant - Kitchen Maid
Where born:   Bristol St Philips
Civil Parish:   Westbury On Trym
County/Island:   Gloucestershire
Country:   England
Street address:   Brentry House

The family are in Radyr in Glamorgan and the father is still an engine fitter.  I have taken the difference in place of birth to be the enumerators as the area of Bristol seems to be the same parish,

My next question is how do I confirm this Annie as my GGGrand Mother?  With no records but the Marriage and Death Certificates I have no ready references to cross check any birth certificates etc.
Any ideas greatly appreciated.

[ScouseBoy]

Do a cross check on all the names on the marriage certificate, including the witnesses.

[delta208]

Thanks ScouseBoy,

Problem I have is the witnesses are not family members.  I have one as an Alice Harrington and the other reads like "P McIntyre".  Neither of which seem to figure in the census records close to Annie & Thomas.

The wedding was at the "Presbyterian Church of England" in Farnham on May 25, 1885.  The church no longer exists.