100th Regiment - 2 months Hard Labour -

[Jean McGurn]

Got very excited last weekend, I discovered that a relative who has been very elusive was actually a soldier in the 100th Regt of Foot. He was actually involved with another soldier in  assulting a police constable in Manchester in April 1870. This has thrown up all sorts of questions.

1. Both men were given 2 months Hard Labour or pay £2 + 9/- costs. Does this mean they had a choice?
2. Discharged date June 3 1870 - Does this mean they served the sentence?
 3 Both men's address was Barracks, Regent Road, Salford In 1871 census it is the 8th Regt not the 100th so had the Regiment already left for India?

Would both men, if they served the sentence - Manchester Strangeways Prison - have stayed in the army

When did the 100th leave for India and where did they go.
Have not been able to find out this info as most sites just say the Regiment went to India but not why or where.

Canm anyone help please?

Jean

[gortonboy]

hi,,i can check the prison registers if you give the names and years of birth,and where born ?

[Jean McGurn]

He was Christopher McGurn b 1850 LIverpool (my ancestor) and the other soldier was William Crewe b Middlesex. Been unable to even find William Crewe in the 1871 census either.

Jean

[km1971]

Hi Jean

The 100th Regiment were in Manchester (which as you say usually meant Salford barracks) from September 1869 to October 1870. They then moved to Bury and were there for the 1871 census. They did not leave for India until October 1877.

The 2nd Battalion of the 8th Foot and the Depot of the 1st Battalion were in ‘Manchester’ for the 1871 census.

Regarding the other questions, I would guess that they were given the option of a fine of about three months pay, which they probably did not have, so went to gaol.

Ken

[gortonboy]

hi,,i can check the prison registers if you give the names and years of birth,and where born ?

i am a wally,,,the info you posted was from the prison registers,,,

[Jean McGurn]

hi,,i can check the prison registers if you give the names and years of birth,and where born ?

i am a wally,,,the info you posted was from the prison registers,,,

I don't think you are a wally    I was sort of hoping you might have other info from maybe a different register perhaps to say what 'hard labour' they had to perform. Been reading up on the term and it seems can be a number of things - other than breaking up rock 

Ken, do you think the men would have gone back to the 100th, transferred to a different regiment or would they have been court martialled?

Jean

[km1971]

Ken, do you think the men would have gone back to the 100th, transferred to a different regiment or would they have been court martialled?

You have him as being discharged 'June 3, 1870'. I took it to mean 'from the army'. If it was 'from civil prison' he would have gone back to his regiment. Do you have his army papers? It will say in these what happened to him.

The CO would not need a court martial to dismiss him. But discharge from the army was not automatic. It would have been too easy for men who did not have the money to purchase a discharge £10-£20) to get themselves sentenced to a few months ILH. But he may have decided he did not need/want them.

Hard labour could mean breaking up rocks to be used for road building. Or operating a hand crank that did nothing for 6-8 hours a day. Later in the century they introduced a treadmill, again that did nothing. It also usually meant sleeping on a plank without a mattress or pillow.

http://www.oldbaileyonline.org/static/Punishment.jsp#imprisonment

Ken

[Jean McGurn]

Only discovered him at the weekend, until then had thought he had emigrated. So no papers. He is not in the Chelsea or Militia records on FindMyPast either. That was the first place I looked. Fingers crossed there are more to come and he's one of them 

I have the GRO details of when he married in 1882 so will have to send off for the cert which I hope will tell me he was still a soldier.

Jean