Having trouble corroborating the family story...

[Belboz99]

Hey all,

I'm having a really hard time corroborating the story I've been told my whole life about my father's family history.  Things don't add up entirely, but more than that, there's a complete lack of credible information, records of any type, that back it up.

The story I've been told is that my father's grandfather Patrick Connell was a kid when he came to New York from Dublin, Ireland with his parents (Martin and Mary [Keegan] and siblings in the 1870's.

The story continues that he married Margaret Mary Divers, who went by Maggie, around 1900 and had about 5 kids, one of them, the youngest, was my grandfather John Joseph.  The only other survivors were Martin and Margaret, who my father calls "Aunt Toots".  My grandfather was born around 1912, married Helen Creighton around 1938, and had my Aunt Marylin the following year, and my father in 1940.

The story adds that when my grandfather was a baby his father died from complications of being run over by a horse drawn carriage while attempting to save some kids.  My grandfather passed in 1969 from cancer, his wife passed in 1995 (IIRC), and Aunt Toots made it until 2002 I want to say, she was just shy of 100.


At any rate, I've been trying to pull up records and fill in gaps in the story with written documents from the era.

Part of the story pans out, I've got a birth cert for Patrick Connell to a Martin and Mary (Keegan) in Dublin on March 16th, 1865.  I've got an immigration record from 1878 which shows Martin and Mary Connell with children Pat, Mary, and Henry, plus a 1 year old named Eliza who is not their child, instead listed as "Self", but she still has the same last name, possibly a Niece.

I've also got a copy of the original marriage cert from Patrick and Margaret Divers wedding in 1901, also showing parents names of the groom as Martin Connell and Mary (Keegan), bride's parents are Hugh Divers and Hannah (Mulcahy). which is also information that my mother  had gathered from Aunt Toots previously.

But besides some additional census records, that's about all that lines up.  What's odd is that after the marriage is where things start to fall apart.

I've read the letter that my father's Aunt wrote to my mother when she was doing geneaology in the mid-1980's.  I have a scanned in digital copy I can refer to.  She stated that her last memory of her father was just before she was 4 years old,  of him sitting on the front porch with his coat and hat on waiting for the ambulance to take him away.  She said her mother later told her that he had been injured from trying to stop a run away horse and carriage to save some kids, and never recovered.

Looking at this one event, Aunt Toots was born in 1909, in late July.  This puts her turning 4 at July 1913.

Now, I've looked and looked, and I cannot find any record of Patrick O'Connell's death.  (the O' was put back on shortly after he married).  I've looked for any death certs for Patrick Connell and O'Connell for that entire decade, and I've ready through every orbituary on the NYT which includes the name Connell.   The only mention of a Patrick J. O'Connell was an in memorandum, and considering the possibility it was a 1 year memorial service I went back another year, nothing.

I also checked the NYT for stories that matched the one given about the runaway horse and carriage, and the only one that fits has an Officer Martin Connell saving a small girl from being run over by an automobile in 1912, with potentially mortal wounds.  Now, Martin Connell is the name of Patrick's father, so we're seeing some interesting deviation from the story.

More on that, where is Martin and his wife Mary this whole time?  Nothing in the family story indicates what became of them.  Patrick Connell was likely living with them until 1883 when he would have turned 18, but Patrick didn't get married until he was 37.

Continued...

[Belboz99]

Continued from above...

Adding to the mix, I can find the entire family, Patrick, Margaret, and their kids in the 1905 Census, but not the 1910.  1910 is the only Census record where I cannot find Patrick, Margaret, or any of their kids.  1920 it's just Margaret and her 3 surviving kids.  1930 census when my grandfather was 18 they were still living together, but with his older brother Martin as the Head of the house.

Patrick had a brother Henry, he's actually listed on the same 1905 Census record, possibly neighbors.  Henry married a Kate Bowls several years before his brother Patrick got married, and already had 5 kids.  By the 1910 Census, Henry is gone, Katherine is listed as a Widow, much the same as with Patrick's wife Margaret in 1920.

I've looked a fair amount, not as extensively as with Patrick, but I can't find a death cert for Henry Connell either.


This is just really weirding me out, because by 1920, my grandfather's father and uncle are both purportedly dead, with no records to verify against.  And there's no real information anywhere on his grandparents either after that time.

Aunt Toots talks about how her father had two sisters (One was born in the States) that married rich husbands, and never talked to them or helped them out at all.

I want to believe the family story, but part of me is looking at this saying "could Patrick have simply left Margaret?  Could the memory Aunt Toots had of him waiting for the ambulance been for an ambulance for her mother who gave birth to my grandfather in Nov 1912?  Could the story her mother told her about how her father died been a lie meant to protect her from the truth, borrowed from either the newspaper or an actual story about her grandfather?  Could she  simply be mixing up facts and info?"

Also, the entire family is adamant that Patrick was Roman Catholic.  However, the priest that married him resided in an Anglican Church, St. Luke-of-the-Fields.

If Patrick did affiliate himself as Anglican, which has strong ties with England, this could have put him and his family at odds with other family and people in Ireland.

I need a way to create a verifiable story, one with written accounts and records from the era.

Anyone know how I should tackle this?

Thanks,
Dan O.

[Lemontree]

I am struggling to read this as:

 sometimes you refer to these people by their names - then you refer to some people by their relationship to your father.

Could you just jot down which two men you are trying to find death certificates for, give their names and their dates of birth - as I think that is your question?

That way hopefully we can help you without trying to read through the post and decipher who it is you are looking for

[alpinecottage]

I don't know about New York records, how complete they are and how easy to search, but I've got a couple of comments;
Firstly, it's a bit unlikely that someone who had been run over by a horse and cart would sit quietly waiting for an ambulance to arrive, then die because the injuries were so bad.  It is more likely that Patrick just left Margaret, either to go somewhere else to find work or for marital reasons or possibly to sign up to the War effort.  The memory of a four year old is not reliable - she may have been getting several occasions mixed up together, as you suggest.

Secondly, Catholics marry in Anglican Churches for various reasons, one being that in those days, Catholic priests wouldn't marry a Catholic and a non-Catholic and another that they wouldn't marry a divorcee either. Could his wife Margaret been either of these?

Thirdly, have you checked that Patrick and his brother Henry  (and parents) didn't go back to Ireland for some reason?  You can search the Irish 1911 census free of charge.



 

[Nick29]

From my experience of my own family history, there is always a grain of truth in family stories, but the facts are often embellished, distorted, enhanced, and the dates get changed, as the stories are passed around.  You need to get the stories from as many people in the family as you can, and then sit down and try to 'separate the wheat from the chaff'.

[Belboz99]

Thanks all,

The person i most would like info on is Patrick Connell, who went by O'Connell after he was married.
Born in Dublin, Ireland on March 16th, 1865 to Martin Connell and Mary (Keegan).
He immigrated to the United States in 1878 with his parents and siblings, lived in NYC.
He married Margaret Mary Divers in 1901 in Manhattan.
He had several children, only surviving children are Martin, Margaret, and John Joseph.
Last known official record is the 1905 Census, with his wife and children.
Last family account of him is around 1913.

I don't know what became of Martin, Patrick and Margaret's son, he would have been the oldest the last time Patrick was seen.  My father mentioned him a few times, from what I gather he was never "quite right" and after being dropped off in Saigon during the War he was never quite the same.

Margaret O'Connell (Divers) passed in 1946.  This leaves my great aunt, ^(*), daughter of Patrick and Margaret (Divers) as the only witness to what became of her father Patrick in our line.  (John was barely a few years old)  Every story we have of the Connell's originates from her, which means almost every story we have is 2nd hand that she heard from her mother while growing up.

The marriage cert shows both Patrick and Margaret as "First" marriage, unless the fibbed?

Thanks again,
Dan O.


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