Local knowledge - Dedham

[MaxD]

Coopers Lane appears on modern and old maps (back to 1790) of Dedham but doesn't seem to be listed in any of the census enumeration district descriptions I've looked at.  West Street appears in the censuses but not on the maps.  Looking at the detail of a number of census listings, it looks as if West Street is/was Coopers Lane.  Also, the Prince of Wales pub, listed in 1901 in West Street and 1911 in Coopers Lane, looks to have been on the corner of Coopers Lane and Castle Hill (present day names) and the house now standing there looks very much as if it might have been the pub once.

Would someone local be able to unravel the West Street/Coopers Lane thing and perhaps confirm the location of the Prince of Wales pub in present day terms?

MaxD

[t mo]

didn,t we go down some of these lanes some time back i seem to remember !
regards
trevor

[MaxD]

Not with me (as far as I can remember!).

MaxD

[t mo]

sorry maxd  it,s just we did a search for what i can,t remember now in this very same area sometime ago at least a yr i suppose , any old how i,ve just looked at the censuses on FindMyPast and using the address search for coopers lane it comes up in all available ones , also on google st view the big house on the corner of coopers lane with the garages under it i,m certain you,ll find is a recent new build it doesn,t even look like a conversion .
i presume you didn,t mean castle house over the rd where alfred munnings lived .
regards
trevor

[MaxD]

Trevor

Couldn't find anything on Roots using the search facility and yes, the house thing was a bit of wishful thinking!

I don't quite follow your FindMyPast reference.  In 1881, the Prince of Wales pub is in West street and Coopers Lane does not appear in any of the 4 EDs for Dedham and indeed on any of the census pages.  In 1901 it is still in West Street but in 1911 however, the pub is in Coopers Lane hence my query that West Street is Coopers lane.  I still can't explain why Coopers Lane appears on many maps and West Street doesn't!

Thanks for your interest anyway.

[t mo]

here,s the censuses in order
1911 19 addresses in coopers lane  no west st in list of addresses in dedham
1901 no coopers lane   and 30 addresses in west st
1891 coopers lane  1 address and west st 1 address
1881 coopers lane no addresses 3 addresses in west st incl prince of wales pub
1871 coopers lane no addresses  and 27 in west st incl pow
1861 coopers lane 2 addresses  and no west st in list
1851 coopers lane 29 addresses  and no west st in list
1841 coopers lane 26 addresses  and no west st in list
in FindMyPast and ancestry you can do look ups for both a person search and an address search , what i do is in address search just put in dedham no other detail it then brings up a list of all streets and other establishments which are in the census in there own right hence the above .
may i ask are you looking for a person or a place in either coopers lane or west st .
hope the above makes sense
trevor

[MaxD]

Trevor

I won't profess to know why, but the method of searching you describe doesn't seem to produce the right answer.  If we take first the 1881 as an example and actually browse (I use Ancestry) through the pages of Enumeration District 3 which covers the relevant area, we indeed find no Coopers Lane addresses but no less than 30 households on West Street, the last of which is the POW pub.  In the 1891 ED 3 again no Coopers Lane but 30 West street households.
However, what your info does seem to support is that the same street that is now Coopers lane has been called West St in the past, which is really all I was trying to confirm.
The query started by me wondering where my great grandfather Joseph Double, who lived on West Street in 1881, actually had his Baker's shop and then noting that where he lived seemed to have the 2 names.

[t mo]

yes i can see i,ve gone off on a tangent [ i,m good at that  ] but as much as anything i was trying to show that on some censuses both west st and coopers lane come up , i,ve confused you and me and i wrote it  .
regards
trevor
ps i,m getting to the stage were i might take a ride out there and have a look round .

[vabbott]

sorry maxd  it,s just we did a search for what i can,t remember now in this very same area sometime ago at least a yr i suppose , any old how i,ve just looked at the censuses on FindMyPast and using the address search for coopers lane it comes up in all available ones , also on google st view the big house on the corner of coopers lane with the garages under it i,m certain you,ll find is a recent new build it doesn,t even look like a conversion .
i presume you didn,t mean castle house over the rd where alfred munnings lived .
regards
trevor

Hi Trev
I think it was when we were looking for the workhouses in Dedham We spent quite a while didnt we
Coopers Lane is listed as  nothing more than cottages built by a hedge lined  dirt track in listings i have seen which is possibly  why there is no trace on maps but it was off of Long Road I will see what I can find out next time i go
ronnie