Author Topic: JOHNS FAMILY  (Read 7421 times)

Offline cando

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 07:06 BST (UK) »
Amendment....Thomas is not listed on the 1928 electoral roll.

Cando
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Offline cando

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 07:19 BST (UK) »
These are to two birth regs mentioned on the thread. So many online trees copy information from one to another without purchasing validating documents.  :-X :-X

JOHNS Thomas
Father William  Mother Elizabeth LANGBRIDGE
7 Sep 1851
At Hamilton  Reg#219/1851

JOHNS Thomas Edward
Father Samuel James  Mother Ellen WIGGINS
3 Apr 1854  Hobart  Reg#842/1857

This is the only other Thomas JOHNS marriage to 1900 and he states he was born c1845.

JOHNS Thomas  23 years
HIGGINS Charlotte  17 years
25 Aug 1868 
At Deloraine  Reg#51/1868

Perhaps Thomas JOHNS born c1853 who married Henrietta BENNETT was not born in Tasmania.

Cando

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Offline Rose_Frankcombe

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 07:40 BST (UK) »
I think, 'cando', that my best bet it to get a valid certificate of birth registration for Thomas Johns, with parents inscribed upon it (hopefully). That way the uncertainties and discrepancies will be eliminated. Guess-work could go on indefinitely, so a solid conclusion to this aspect of the story can be resolved and other doors can be opened. 

Offline Rose_Frankcombe

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 08:08 BST (UK) »
I did post a thank you to 'cando', 'Noells' and 'Sparrett' (Sue) but where it's gone, is anyone's guess. I will wait a little longer this time, to make sure this one uploads! LOL

I found it interesting, Sue, that your post suggested there had been a split between Thomas and Henrietta, as, between me and my husband, who is a great-grandson of Thomas and Henrietta, with us having only begun this research in recent days, we, too, are both also coming to that conclusion. Especially now we've viewed Thomas's grave in Campbelltown - and find Henrietta is buried in Bothwell. We thought that may have been for practical purposes. However, it appears it was not. Thomas has a lovely headstone - and a surround that's weathering - but his details inscribed on marble are scant, with just his name and his date of death in 1922.

Henrietta, however, is a different story altogether. Much sadder in many, many respects. She's buried in the Bothwell cemetery, in an unmarked grave for which there's no longer a record.

I have been scouring Trove for any mention of Thomas, until his death, but found no death notice. I did, however, last night find the small item in the Zeehan and Dundas Herald, would you believe, of the damages claim he'd made for an ambitious 500 pounds, with his case as the plaintiff being upheld but the damages awarded far from the ambit claim, him gaining a mere 40 pounds, which I guess was no mean amount in the day anyway, I would say...

I've had no further success with him via Trove, so your additional links are very exciting...

I hadn't realised, 'Noells', that there were other references to the Johns listed. I did look prior to posting my initial query, but obviously didn't see the ones that were already there.

With the contention as to who wins the prize in the parents' stakes, I think it would be wisest to go to the BDM's registry and order a copy of Thomas's birth certificate. Hopefully, and I would expect the parents names to be there. I wonder what it will reveal...

And 'cando', the listings of the marriages of the various siblings, is also valuable. Our connection is to Amy May (Ismay) and, although we knew she was married at Oatlands, until your posting we didn't know she was married in St Peters.


Offline Noells

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 10:29 BST (UK) »
Hi
I agree with your plan to purchase the birth certificate. According to a document I have which sets out what you should expect to find on various bdm certificates you should hopefully get the name and occupation of the father and the name and maiden name of the mother. In addition of course to the name,date and place of birth of the child

Fingers crossed ;D

Noells
Anderson,Fry,Poad, Fort, -England, Australia
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Offline cando

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 11:02 BST (UK) »
My concern is ...yes the birth certificate will detail the parents but an 1883 marriage registration in Tasmania will not.  The death index indicates there are no parents detailed on Thomas's death certificate.

Thomas's Will leaves all his assets to son William Robert, who was also the sole executor.  Perhaps it was Wm who was responsible for the headstone.
http://portal.archives.tas.gov.au/menu.aspx?search=9

Quote
She's buried in the Bothwell cemetery, in an unmarked grave for which there's no longer a record.

Are you saying there are no Burial Orders or Burial Register entries for the cemetery?  There are a number of cemeteries listed at Bothwell.  In which one is Henrietta buried?

Cheers
Cando
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Offline wivenhoe

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 11:50 BST (UK) »



Mercury 7 Sep 1938
death Henrietta Louisa Johns, of Kenna Leena, Shannon, relict of Thomas Johns d. 6 Nov at Bothwell  eldest d/o Robert and Ellen Bennett of Oatlands   73yrs

funeral to leave from res. Mrs John Goggins   St Michaels and All Angels Bothwell


There is a will for Thomas Johns, d. 11 Aug 1922 executor and beneficiary is son William Robert Johns.

Offline sparrett

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 12:48 BST (UK) »
did, however, last night find the small item in the Zeehan and Dundas Herald, would you believe, of the damages claim he'd made for an ambitious 500 pounds, with his case as the plaintiff being upheld but the damages awarded far from the ambit claim, him gaining a mere 40 pounds, which I guess was no mean amount in the day anyway, I would say...

Yes, I linked some of this for you  in reply #6

The separation of the couple is quite evident.

If you study the Electoral Roll entries from Cando you will note the divisions in the family in terms of their addresses.

William Robert JOHNS, the son and inheritor, tried to join the ww1 forces but had health problems which precluded this.
His mother was his Next Of Kin in 1917 , but father in 1916.  They had different addresses.

You can see his digitised service records -

http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/using/search/

He applied again for the ww2 forces and his NOK then was Eileen Johns.

Sue
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Offline Rose_Frankcombe

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Re: JOHNS FAMILY
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 29 August 12 15:11 BST (UK) »
Hello again, everyone,
Yes, 'Noells', I will get on to the application for a birth certificate for Thomas ASAP. Fingers will be crossed that it reveals what I would like to know... I am hoping a birth certificate/registration document will be more revealing than a Marriage Certificate or a Death Certificate would, although I wondered if a Death Certificate would contain a note on cause of death.

And 'cando', Henrietta, of Kanna Leena, Shannon, 1938, was taken from the residence of Mrs Goggin, to St Michael's and All Angels Anglican Church, Bothwell, where a Rev. Walter Walters performed the service, and then she was buried in the general cemetery nearby. I have been in touch with Bothwell, and all who have followed up my queries have been extremely helpful. However, I have been given a reply that there are a number of unmarked graves in the cemetery and it is unknown in which one Henrietta lies.  I have looked at Gravesites of Tasmania, and there she's not listed for Bothwell.

I did download a copy of Thomas's will the other night and was surprised to find his beneficiary and executor was his fourth child and second son. I notice from the information you have supplied, William married in the same year as his father died. It could well have been William who arranged the headstone and grave surround for his father. Henrietta's father also died in this year, 1922, in October, from memory.

Until I followed the link you supplied Sue, I thought it would be to the just brief few lines from the Zeehan and Dundas Herald (don't you just love that title), but no, it was a fuller version of what happened, but not enough to fully satisfy and only brought about further curiosity as to what the fracas was all about...

Ah, more for me to look at. It occurred to me that WWI may have had an effect on family members, deciding that perhaps Thomas was too old to be considered but maybe his sons were not.

So, for this post, thank you, everyone... Until next time... Rose