Author Topic: Viking legacy in Galway  (Read 8018 times)

Offline CarolAST

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Viking legacy in Galway
« on: Sunday 21 October 12 10:22 BST (UK) »
From the Galway News, Oct. 5, 2012

A team of scientists from the Mary Immaculate College in Limerick and the University of Leiceister are looking for specific Galway families to undergo DNA tests in order to discover the genetic and social legacy of the Vikings in the area. The project is looking for volunteers aged 18 or over from a list of established Galway surnames to undergo DNA testing in Kelly’s Bar in Galway on October 21.
 
The study will reveal whether Galway’s medieval families are genetically linked to Normans or to Vikings, and it will investigate the extent to which the Vikings intermarried with the native population. One of the reasons for choosing people with traditional Galway surnames for the test is the extent to which internal migration has affected the Irish population in recent centuries.

Among the surnames eligible for the test are Broderick, Browne, Burke, Carr, Casey, Clancy, Collins, Donnellan, Lally, Lee, Moran, Morris, Murray, Naughton,, O’Flaherty, Regan, Tighe, Tully and Walsh.

http://www.galwaynews.ie/28124-viking-legacy-galway-be-studied

Offline villandra

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 18 November 12 19:23 GMT (UK) »
Carol:

I'm sure the more DNA savvy of us would really like more information on how you intend to genetically identify Vikings.   Unfortunately, past studies have been conducted by specific university departments in England that lack depth, and tried to use 5 or 6 Y DNA STR markers to distinguish "invaders"; they actually didn't try to distinguish haplogroup I1 Norse from non-Norse at that level, though it's easy to do with more complex testing.   To distinguish Norse DNA, you are actually better off testing some common SNPs that are known to be associated with Vikings.

How do you specifically intend to distinguish Viking from Saxon DNA, especially given that Saxon DNA is as common north of Denmark as anywhere else?

Also, are you looking just for those with reason to think they have Viking DNA, or also for people who suspect Norman ancestry?   That's quite a difference.  What is more, the only way I know that people think they're specifically of Norman ancestry is if they also think, usually wrongly, that their ancestors were Norman aristocrats.   

My Scottish Smiths are such a family, now, if you're interested.  They belong to a genetic cluster, one group within which insists that they are descended from a Flemish/ Norman knight whose line became the Earls of Whatever (immediately north of the Firth of Forth)   Might be true, might not.   The Y DNA is non-Norse I1.   On the continent it has been found along the Rhine River, which doesn't rule out Vikings OR Normans, though I tend to think Allemans or Saxons.   It actually turns up in a Jewish family of southeastern Netherlands who allegedly came from any of three towns on the Middle Rhine - now, haplogroup I1 ain't Jewish and God knows when the nonpaternity event occurred. 

Let me know if you think my brother is a candidate, but we will want the specifics on your methodology, as frankly no intelligent genetic genealogical research has ever been done in Great Britain.   

Yours,
Dora Smith

Offline villandra

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 18 November 12 19:44 GMT (UK) »
Never mind the my brother part - we're from Scotland!

Dora

Offline CarolAST

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #3 on: Monday 19 November 12 13:10 GMT (UK) »
First of all, this is not "my" study - I am not connected with it in any way. I merely saw the story in the Galway paper and posted it here. For details, you would have to get in touch with them. At any rate, the testing is free. This seems to be their main web page:

http://leicestersurnamesproject.org.uk/

For information about the genetic aspects of the study, please contact Dr Turi King at surnames@le.ac.uk


Offline villandra

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 24 November 12 14:16 GMT (UK) »
Free is helpful.  In the U.S., Genographic is doing a low quality project and charging participants $200 for the priviledge, and they're going for it!   

I doubt the Oxford University bunch really care.   It's just good for other people to be aware that historically, this is not high quality research.

Really, the best way to contribute to the progress of genealogy DNA research is to test with Family Tree DNA, (http://www.ftdna.com), and then get involved with appropriate projects.   They really make rapid headway!

Dora

Offline CarolAST

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 24 November 12 14:54 GMT (UK) »
One side of my family is from Scotland, too, with the also-common name of Thompson. And maybe the nonpaternity event was a conversion event.

Wikipedia says that "Genographic Project public participation kits are processed by Family Tree DNA (FTDNA) using the Arizona Research Labs at the University of Arizona." They've got some big names on their advisory board, such as Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genographic_Project

Offline Redroger

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #6 on: Monday 26 November 12 11:40 GMT (UK) »


Really, the best way to contribute to the progress of genealogy DNA research is to test with Family Tree DNA, (http://www.ftdna.com), and then get involved with appropriate projects.   They really make rapid headway!

Dora

Except that I had their test three years ago, one 36/37 marker match first day, since then Zilch!
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Proctor Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)

Offline Skoosh

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #7 on: Monday 26 November 12 11:47 GMT (UK) »
Carol,  Scottish Thomson's don't usually have a "P", English/Irish origin maybe for Thompson?

Skoosh.

Offline CarolAST

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Re: Viking legacy in Galway
« Reply #8 on: Monday 26 November 12 14:41 GMT (UK) »
Carol,  Scottish Thomson's don't usually have a "P", English/Irish origin maybe for Thompson?

Skoosh.

Just a spelling change. I don't need to guess where they're from.

The Irish name I'm interested in is Burke et al. They went to an area of Norway north of the Arctic Circle during the Famine. The climate there is much milder than people might think. I don't know where in Ireland they came from.