Baptism and/or Marriage Lookup please - Sutton in Ashfield ELLIS

[Purdie1972]

Hello,
I was wondering if someone could please help? I'm searching for the baptism of Caroline ELLIS (about 1822) in Sutton in Ashfield so that I can find out the name of her mother.
She is recorded on the 1841 Census living in Sutton in Ashfield with her father Samuel ELLIS (but no mother - presumably dead?). She married Joseph BRAILSFORD in 1843 and lived to the ripe old age of 82.
Samuel ELLIS was baptised in 1782 in Sutton in Ashfield, son of Charles ELLIS and Emma DAUBNEY. I would imagine that he was married some time between 1800 and 1822.
Unfortunately, the IGI is coming up blank. I would be so grateful for any help!
Thank you.
Purdie

[Alexander.]

Hi Purdie,

One question - do you have Caroline's marriage certificate which confirms her father's name and occupation? The reason I ask is because the 1841 census does not state the relationship between Samuel and Caroline; while she is most likely his daughter, we can't know that for certain without confirmation from the marriage certificate.

I see on the 1841c Samuel and Caroline were living with Elizabeth Ralph (nee Ellis, married Richard Ralph in 1833), possably a sister of Caroline's?

Alexander

[sunflower]

I can't help with the baptism or marriage, but there are a couple of burials in Sutton in Ashfield in 1812 which states they were children of Samuel & Mary Ellis.

Carol

[Purdie1972]

Hi Alexander
Thanks for responding. Yes, I do have Caroline's marriage certificate somewhere (although I can't get my hands on it) which is where I got the information re her father from. That is interesting about her putative sister - I'll see if I can track her baptism down.

Hi Carol
Thanks for doing that search for me. That is really helpful information. I'm beginning to get more of a picture of their family now.

Purdie 

[jillruss]

Hi,

I've looked on the 3 Notts FHS CDs for Baptisms, Marriages and Burials. I cannot find a baptism for a Caroline Ellis - and no marriage for Samuel Ellis in Sutton in Ashfield.

However, there is this marriage in nearby Mansfield: 9 Oct 1815 Samuel ELSE and Ann Black.

Given what you said about the mother not being present on the 1841 census, I also found these burials in Mansfield:

11 March 1823 Ann ELSE d/o Samuel & Ann age 1 abode: Ravens Dale Farm
27 June 1833 Ann ELSE 42 wife of Samuel  abode: Newgate Lane.

I wouldn't worry too much about the Ellis/Else - a lot of parish clerks wrote it how they heard it!

I also think it might be worth your while thinking nonconformist! There is a possible christening for Caroline Ellis in 1815 at the Mansfield Monthly Quaker Meeting. Unfortunately, I could only do the free search on the BMD site as I don't have a subscription to the site in order to discover the details. It may be a coincidence - or it may be your Caroline.

Hope that's not confusing the issue too much!

Jill

[Alexander.]

I also think it might be worth your while thinking nonconformist! There is a possible christening for Caroline Ellis in 1815 at the Mansfield Monthly Quaker Meeting. Unfortunately, I could only do the free search on the BMD site as I don't have a subscription to the site in order to discover the details. It may be a coincidence - or it may be your Caroline.

I considered her too - but her parents were William and Sarah Ellis.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/F7F3-1QL

Alexander

[jillruss]

At least that lays that one to rest, Alexander.

It just seems strange that the Sutton in Ashfield and Mansfield baptisms are on the CD - but no Caroline to be found. That's why I thought they might have been nonconformists.

Purdie, have you found Caroline on any later censuses? If so, what does she give as her birthplace?

Jill

[Purdie1972]

Hi All
Many thanks for the research and the ideas.
In answer to your questions:
Non-conformist HAD crossed my mind but I discounted it because: Samuel Ellis had a CofE baptism and his daughter had a CofE wedding.
I know that Caroline  states her birthplace as Sutton in Ashfield on the 1891 and 1901 censuses (although I can't find the family at all on the 1881c) - I suppose she could have believed to have been born/baptised there but it was in fact somewhere else - but I thought that quite unlikely as her father was born there and was still there in 1841, suggesting that they had always lived there.
The idea of Samuel and Ann Else is interesting but, if there were burials of children for Samuel and Mary Ellis in Sutton in Ashfield in 1812, I would have thought that they were more likely candidates.
Hmmm, it's a bit of a puzzler!
Purdie