My mysterious grandfather - Ernest McQuillan Hargraves

[Eric Hatfield]

Okay....this is a big longshot, but one never knows. .....  And I have to ask the question Eric, is it possible that you are of Chinese heritage?

Hi Deb, that is an amazing find. My wife thinks it isn't possible, because that would make me one-eighth Chinese and my mother one quarter, but there is no evidence of any of the characteristic Chinese features such as straight black hair - most of my relatives in this line have brown wavy to curly hair.

But I am not so sure. Possibilities include:

1. The original Mr Ah Sing may have already only had one Chinese ancestor (say a grandfather), so my genetic inheritance would have been far less Chinese.

2. I'm intrigued by the marriage to Mr Mardgraves (presumably a mis-spelling) in 1874, and the birth of children surnamed Ah Sing in the period 1882-1892. I have heard of cases (there is one I found in my wife's family line) where a woman had children by several different fathers, some named, some unnamed, and there being some uncertainty about which of several men were the father in some cases. The final surname can reflect current partnership rather than the actual biological father. I think it may also be possible that some births are registered long after the actual birth.

So could it be possible that Mr "Mardgraves" was the biological father but the births were registered under Mr Ah Sing?

This leads me to a few other questions please ....

1. Why were these children on the state wards registers if they had mother and father? Had the parents died or split??
2. Was the date of George Henry's birth in the BMD register also 1888? Could the birth have been earlier than the registration?
3. Did you check any of his siblings' births in the Aust Birth Index? (If not I will do that when I can get to the library.) I would guess that birth dates in a state wards register might be less reliable.
4. I wonder whether Mr "Mardgraves" had any children in the birth index. Again I will check.

As you say, it's a big long shot, but I don't have any easy shots left, so it is definitely worth looking at further. I think it is doubtful I have Chinese heritage, but I think it would be rather fun if I did. Thanks a lot for your amazing detective work.

[Eric Hatfield]

Deb, I don't have Ancestry available at present, but Google searching found these two interesting pages:

A Roots Web page on Annie Margaret Nolan - showing her birth in County Monaghan, and shwing some of her children (though not George Henry Ernest).

A MyTrees.com page showing birthdates for William Hargreaves and Annie.

Interesting to see if this William has any connection to the Hargraves family I already know about in Victoria.

[tedscout]

I have 2 sons.

Their father is 1/4 Burmese. He has black curly hair and olive skin and very is Australian looking.

One son has brown straight hair with brown eyes and looks just like me (I am as English as you can find).

The other son has blue eyes and brown curly hair and my face shape but he has Asian shaped eyes.

Their grandfather does not look very Asian either. He has Caucasian eyes, olive skin and had (its now grey) black hair.

I actually didn't know that my sons' great grandmother was Burmese until the Blue eyed boy was born and I questioned his eye lid shape.

So don't rule out the Chinese connection. The genes might just be recessive.

[tedscout]

I also have to add that NO white Caucasian woman in the late 1880's - early 1900's would give her children a Chinese surname unless they had a Chinese father.

The stigma of having a Chinese father was probably worse than being illegitimate.

So keep an open mind. Deb might have just found you an ancestry "gold mine"

[Deborah G]

Hi Eric,

This is what I found on The Australian Birth Index:

It appears that William Hargraves and Annie Margaret Nolan had at least one child-
Laura Pearly Maude Myrtle Hargraves born Sale 1879, Reg No.25448 (Quite a name!)

Then managed to track down all the Ah Sing births:

Janet Eveline Ah Sing.
Father James Ah Sing/ Mother Annie Nolan.
Born Sale 1882 Reg No. 18687r

Ann Ah Sing (Annie Mabel on State Ward records).
Father Ah Sing Ah Sing/ Mother Ann Mary Nolan
Born Sale 1884 Reg No. 12475

James Albert Sing
Father James Sing/ Mother Anna Margaret Nolan
Born Sale 1885 Reg No. 28558

George Henry Ah Sing (George Henry Ernest on State Ward records).
Father Ah Sing Ah Sing/ Mother Annie Margaret Nolan
Born Sale 1888 Reg No. 6356

Charles John Reuben Ah Sing (John Charles Enben on State Ward records)
Father Ah Sing/ Mother Annie Marg. Nolan
Born Sale 1890 Reg No. 27212R

Lena Flor Gfrte Ah Sing (Lena Florence Gertrude on State Ward records)
Father James Ah Sing/ Mother Annie Margaret HARGRAVES
Born Sale 1892 Reg No. 7813R

Francis Ethelli Ah Sing (Frances Ethel Lilian on State Ward records)
Father Ah Sing Ah Sing/ Mother Annie M. HARGRAVES
Born Sale 1893 Reg No. 35038R

Interesting that Annie uses the surname HARGRAVES for the last two children. Quite compelling evidence that she is the same woman who married William Hargraves to

It would be wonderful if we could link William Hargraves to Francis Hargraves the policeman. It would then fit nicely if Francis and Mary  then "fostered" young Ernest. Isn't it fun to hypothesise!

Deb

[cando]

It appears that William Hargraves and Annie Margaret Nolan had at least one child-
Laura Pearly Maude Myrtle Hargraves born Sale 1879, Reg No.25448 (Quite a name!)

Another with unknown father

NOLAN Edith Pollard
Father Unknown  Mother Annie Margaret NOLAN
At Sale  1874  Reg#18706

On my resource...ancestry indexes are full of errors.

Marriage
HARDGRAVES William Born Monaghan
NOLAN Annie Margaret  Born Queens County
1874  Reg#4292

Cando

[Eric Hatfield]

Thanks for that reminder, tedscout. I believe there are enough ancestors to make it unlikely that our grandfather was half Chinese, but that doesn't make it impossible, as you say.

Deb, thanks for that extra info. The MyTrees.com page shows William Hargreaves died in Victoria in 1914, and Annie died in Victoria in 1911. RootsWeb shows James Ah Sing (the father of the children) died in 1894 in Sale Victoria. So we have to assume William and Annie split up sometime around 1880, she never married Ah Sing, and when he died she was destitute, William wasn't around, and the children became state wards. Does that make sense?

If so, then George Henry Ernest's father was Ah Sing, unless he was born earlier than 1888, or there was a very irregular "menage a trois" going on, which I doubt.

A few things to check out there now, including trying to trace the key characters on electoral rolls, and trying to connect William Hargreaves with Francis Hargrave's family, perhaps in Ireland. Rootsweb says William Hargeaves was born in "Queens Country" (actually County, now called Laois) and Annie Nolan was born in Monaghan, and Francis' death certificate says he too was born in Monaghan, Ireland, so there may be a connection. But Queens County and Monaghan are not close, so there's some work to be done there.

Thanks again - I definitely have some work to do!

[Eric Hatfield]

Another with unknown father

NOLAN Edith Pollard
Father Unknown  Mother Annie Margaret NOLAN
At Sale  1874  Reg#18706

Wow Cando, that is interesting! Certainly suggests she lived an interesting life, perhaps very poor, and entered into relationships with several men.

Marriage
HARDGRAVES William Born Monaghan
NOLAN Annie Margaret  Born Queens County
1874  Reg#4292

And that is doubly interesting. RootsWeb had the opposite origins, but this info (where exactly did it come from?) puts William Hardgraves (sometimes spelt Hargreaves) and Francis Hargraves, who I know about, from the same County in Ireland. It may be the connection we need to link Ernest to Francis, who he later claimed as his father.

[Deborah G]

There is another birth entry for Frances Ethel:

Frances Ethel Li HARGRAVES
Father Hargraves/ Mother Annie M Hargraves
Born Sale 1893 Reg No. 35038R (Same as before)

Take your pick who the father is!

Deb