Looking for Thomas Tudor, publican, 1860/1870

[Deirdre784]

Hi, wondering if anyone can help with this.

I'm looking for a Thomas Tudor, listed as a publican on son John's marriages certificates (1 October 1864, at Aston chapel, Runcorn, Cheshire to Elizabeth Illidge, and on 14 June 1876 at Lymm parish church, Cheshire to Ann Rutter).

In 1871 John (with Elizabeth and children Sarah Ellen and John) is listed as a railway platelayer, age 36 (1835) born Brewood*, London (Ancestry, as John Hador) or Staffordshire (FindMyPast) [RG10 piece 3686 folio 287 page 21]

In 1881 John is a railway signalman age 43 (1838) with Ann and son John, born in Stanniford(?), Staffordshire [RG11 Piece 3799 folio 65 Page 14]

I can't find him in 1891 and I think he died in 1897.

Before finding the marriage records I'd pencilled in possible parents Thomas and Maria (Simcox), married on 6 July 1936, who had a son John, baptised 19 April 1937 in Wolverhampton, Staffordshire. But I've followed this Thomas and Maria through and Thomas was a puddler (or iron puddler) in the censuses and on the baptism records of his children.

So I'm left wondering if Thomas and Maria are his parents (could Thomas describe himself as a publican if he was a puddler, could it be a mistake - twice? If not, then I'm looking for new parents for John. But I can't find a Thomas Tudor publican in 1861 or 1871.

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Deirdre

* Edited to add: Although Ancestry has transcribed John's 1871 place of birth as Brewood, London (I can't make out the 2nd word myself ) I have just found a Brewood in Staffordshire...

[Milliepede]

The marriage dates you have are between census so in theory he could have been a publican on and off but not at census time.

[MargP]

Hi

Brewood is in Staffordshire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brewood

Margp

[KGarrad]

Is this John in 1891?

Class: RG12; Piece: 4011; Folio: 101; Page: 9
91 Lower Milbank, Middlesbrough

Bennett, William  Head  M  48  Ship Labourer  b Staffordshire
+ family
Tudor, John  Boarder  Widower  M  58  Iron ?? Labourer  b Staffordshire

[Deirdre784]

Is this John in 1891?

Class: RG12; Piece: 4011; Folio: 101; Page: 9
91 Lower Milbank, Middlesbrough

Bennett, William  Head  M  48  Ship Labourer  b Staffordshire
+ family
Tudor, John  Boarder  Widower  M  58  Iron ?? Labourer  b Staffordshire

This looked good when I saw your post (thanks) but I couldn't find the record myself - FindMyPast has the family transcribed as BennetH and John as John Judon - inn works labourer  . However the image appears to be Bennett and John Tudor - iron works labourer - but John is born Shropshire 

The marriage dates you have are between census so in theory he could have been a publican on and off but not at census time.

   
I'm seriously beginning to think it's the wrong family. There's a John Tudor born Wolverhampton in 1837 - which matches the Thomas Tudor (puddler) and Maria Simcox details - who was a solicitor in Brecon and died in 1915. 

Hi

Brewood is in Staffordshire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brewood

Margp

Thanks for the link. 

[Deirdre784]

There's a John Tudor death in Middlesbrough in JunQ 1895, aged 61. I guess the trouble is that if he was still a boarder with the Bennetts the death cert won't confirm anything either way. 

[MargP]

Hi

Who were the witnesses on both the marriages for John, and is there an address on the first marriage, of where he was living in 1864, does this tally with the census for Thomas and Maria

Margp

[Deirdre784]

Morning Margp,

Marriage1 (1 Oct 1865 - not 1864, typo in original post): John and Elizabeth both from Aston, both signed with x. Witnesses were James and Elizabeth Whittey, and Elizabeth Percival (signed x).

Marriage2 (14 June 1876): John and Ann both from Lymm, Ann signed with x. Witnesses were Charles Clare (best guess on surname) and Frances Ellen Burgess.

None of the witnesses appear to be from the families (not as far as I know so far anyway). 

Thomas and Maria Tudor were in Lydney, Glos in 1861 and 1871, Maria died in Lydney in 1879, Thomas still in Lydney in 1881.

Deirdre

[MargP]

Hi Deirdre

I have found this Will

Thomas Tudor died 21 July 1886 at Allastone Meend Lyndney Gloucester proved 24 August 1886 by Charles Blackwell Smale of Lyndney Draper  and sole Executor Effect £27.00

Marg