How can I be sure - Thomas Vick

[Janice Jones]

Hi, i hope you can help a novice please.

I've started looking along my Dad's Mum's line of the family.

I have a photocopy of her birth certificate (Vesta Vick) so I know her parents names (Thomas and Elizabeth) and Dad remembers the names of some Aunts etc so I know I've found the right people on the 1911 Census but by then Elizabeth was a widow now 43 - her 2 eldest children were Ethel 22 and Thomas 21.

I have a photocopy of Thomas and Elizabeth's marriage certificate in Middlesex, April 1988 when he was 27 which states his father was also called Thomas Vick and was a Tailor.

The 1891 Census, in London, shows Thomas Vick age 30 was born in Cheltenham plus wife Elizabeth, 23, daughter Ethel 2 and son Thomas 1 all born in London.  So that looks pretty promising.

The only Thomas Vick born around 1860 in Cheltenham I can find was born to a Thomas Vick (who was born in Malmesbury) and Ann (formerly Oakley, & with 2 sons by a previous marriage) and is on the 1861 Census with them as a 1 year old with a sister Ellen aged 3.
By 1871 Ann Vick with one son of previous marriage, daughter Ellen & son Thomas of the right age is down as the Head and a widow.

I cannot find a death registered for Thomas Vick in the appropriate timescale.

There is a Thomas Vick of the right age and born in Malmesbury as a boarder with Selina Pike in Trowbridge - the handwriting is difficult but looks like both classed as unmarried.
The 1881 Census shows Selina Pike married to a Thomas Vick apparently born in Trowbridge and 1 year younger than I'd have expected.

Is this the right Thomas Vick - how can I be fairly sure?
Has he been a naughty boy?

Are there other avenues I can check, for this line and the other lines of the family, so that I can be sure I have the right people, or can you never be really sure?


My head hurts trying to work this out!!


Any help or advice offered is welcome

Many thanks

Jan

[vronlady]

um . was looking at the family in 1911 and following some of the siblings to  get a feel for the family etc. this appears to be sister mabel.

Mabel Hilda Vick bp 8 Apr 1894, parents Thomas & Elizabeth Vick at St Peter Dartmouth Park Hill 

dad Thomas is down as a traveller. do you know if mabel had a middle name and did she marry Sidney woodcock?

[Janice Jones]

Sorry I don't know if Mabel had a middle name - Dad remembers his Aunt Mabel vaguely, and that she  was a bit younger than Aunt Ethel, but can't recall a middle name at all.

[vronlady]

looking at the marriage entry of Thomas and Elizabeth thomas is given as a traveller.

it doesn't affect going back and I can see what you can see and it does look promising. I will investigate further but I did find something which muddies the water slightly. mabel hilda marries Sidney woodcock and there is a oath of allegiance signed for this marraige. I can send you a copy of the image if you have not seen it and pm me an email address. in it mabel hilda as a minor states  that she has no father and is in guardianship and that her natural mother phoebe burton  has agreed to the marriage. now this doesn't fit with her baptism at all. I cant find another mabel vick around

[vronlady]

strangely the only other baptism I can see is Arthur Sydney in 1892

[jim1]

Have you seen these;
1871
Cheltenham
Samuel Vick/59/tetbury/tailor
Eliza/56/Wiltshire
Peter Oakley/25/Cheltenham
Mary A/25
Edward/2
Mary A/4m

1881
Balsall Heath B'ham
Peter Oakley/36/cheltenham
Mary A/37
Eliza Vick/mother-in-law/66/Wiltshire
Should read grandmother-in-law as she was Thomas' mother.

Peter Oakley married Mary Ann Vick 1867 Cheltenham.
So Peter Oakley married Thomas Vick Snr's. sister Mary Ann.
In 1861 Thomas Vick Snr. is living with Peter's mother Ann Oakley.

This looks like Thomas Vick Snr's. death:
Mar 1894
Vick  Thomas  61  Melksham  5a 93

1891 Thomas Snr. is listed as single.

It doesn't look like Thomas Snr. married either of these women.

[Janice Jones]

Could Thomas, born about 1861 and married to Elizabeth,  have died in the Workhouse?

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1559/31362_190215-01341/90809?backurl=&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

The age is 10 years out and his youngest child would have been 3 years old

I can't find any other record of  this Thomas's death

[jim1]

It looks like him.
Their youngest child Doris was born 1906 & Elizabeth was widowed by 1911.

[jim1]

Also an interesting coincidence, looking at Ann's family I see she was married to Richard Oakley who in 1861 is living with his daughter Jane aged 10 & next door is my Great grandmother Julie Ann Coley.