Confused - McQueen/Thomson Families from Argyll/Paisley - help please

[Ruskie]

FIrstly apologies for the lengthy request, but I wanted to give all the information I had in the hope that it helps anyone willing to give this a try.

PART 1:

A Margaret McQueen marries David Thomson in 1845 in Paisley and they give addresses in Paisley (at least they are proclaimed three tmes but I have not found a record of a marriage). I thought that they went back to Islay after marriage but now I am wondering if this is even the correct marriage. Here is the couple in 1851:
1851 census
21 Glen Lotts, Kildalton, Argyll
David Thomson 26 b 1825 Down Ireland ag lab
Margt 35 b 1816 Kilarrow, argyl
John son 5 b Kilarrow
Margt daur 3 Killarrow
William son 1

1861 census
“To Bowmore”, Kildlaton, Argyll
David Thomson 36 b 1823 b County Down, Slater
Margt wife 40 b Killarrow Argyll
Mary 12 b Kilarrow
William 10
Mary 8
Ann 6
Cath 1 (this is the line I am following)

David disappears after 1861 and in 1879 he is deceased when Catherine marries John Hendrie. Catherine's mother is apparently alive and I think this might be the family in 1871:
1871
4 Barterholm, Abbey Burgh
John Scott 23 b 1848 Ireland Gardener J lab
Margaret wife 23 b 1848 Paisley (ties in with the Margt daur age 3 in 1851 census b Kilarrow)
William Scott son 7months b Paisley
Margaret McQueen 50 b 1821, mother in law, born Islay, occupation: ag lab (slightly odd occupation)
Mary Thomson (Mary McQueen) 18 daur mothers name Margaret McQueen b Paisley occ:Washerwoman
Agnes Thomson age 14 daur b islay occ: exciseman of Stirling (extremely peculiar occupation for a 14 year old girl!)
Cathrine Thomson 11 daur b 1860 daur mothers name Margaret McQueen b Islay no occupation

[I have a birth for Agnes in 1856 but she was not with the family in 1861 - whereabouts unknown].

Catherine Thomson is aged 20 when she marries John Hendrie in 1879, so ages tie in.

Continued .....

[Ruskie]

PART 2:

I have managed to trace a Margaret McQueen in Argyll on the Isle of Islay. Details are:
Margaret McQueen chr 7 August 1814 Killarrow Argyll (I don’t have an exact birth date for her just a christening date). Father is John McQueen. Mother is Mary Johnston.

I found a d/c which I thought may be David Thomson. My David is dead when Catherine marries in 1879 and he does not appear to be around for the 1871 census:
Dec 28 1877 Barterholm Paisley
David Thomson Jobbing Gardener married to Margaret Mcqueen age 52. Father is David Thomson lab (dec), mother is Margaret Armour (dec), informant Margaret Thomson wid present.
(unsure about the gardener occupation but maybe he changed from ag lab/Slater - also in 1871 the son in law is a gardener which may be significant). I have no documentation showing David's parents so am unsure if this is the correct David.

Catherine dies in 1894 by which time her mother is deceased.

I found this death which fits between Margaret Thomson being alive in 1879 but being dead by 1894:
Sept 18 1890 Barterholm Paisley
Margaret Thomson, Widow of 1. Matthew Rowan- (Labr) 2 David Thomson (gardener)
[surname Rowan- is unclear at the end of the word - I thought it may have been Rowans]

This earlier marriage is a mystery to me. As far as I am aware my Margaret only married once to David Thomson (although I do not have a marriage date, they were proclaimed 3 times in 1845 in Paisley - she was a little older than him so there was time for an earlier marriage though I dont know if it would have been in Argyll or Paisley). I found a marriage (proclamation) between a Margaret McQueen and a Matthew Rowand in Paisley in 1837. I am not confident that either marraiges are correct.

On the d/c her parents are given as Donald McQueen crofter (dec) and Ann Clark (dec). I had previously found on Familysearch a christening for Margaret McQueen in Kilarrow on 7 AUg 1814 to parents John McQueen and Mary Johnston.I am willing to believe that I have come to the wrong conclusion about the family in Kilarrow and that I found the wrong Margaret McQueen birth in Kilarrow.

I got even more confused when I looked for a marriage for Donald McQueen and Anne Clark and find that a Donald McQueen marries a Nancy Clark on 24 Jan 1815 in Killarrow Argyl ...they have a daughter chr 15 June 1816 called Peggy McQueen. I wonder if this is her? It does seem odd that she was christened as Peggy and was later known as Margaret - I would think it usually the other way around?

Have I got the families muddled up? Which is my McQueen family? Can anyone find a death for Matthew Rowan-?

There are a few inconsistencies with ages and places of birth which niggle me a bit.

I originally thought that this might be my Margaret, age 25, with her parents John and Mary:
1841 census (I don’t know what the relationships are between these McQueens):
Farm part of Conlalach, Bowmore, Argyll
John McQueen 80 b 1761 Argyll
Mary 70 b 1771 Argyll
Merron 40 b 1801 Argyll
William 20
Mary 10
Margaret 25 [the Margaret McQueen/David Thomson marriage (proclamation) I have for 1845 says that Margaret is aged 28 which fits quite well to be this Margaret. Where is Matthew Rowan/d?]

If this is the wrong family where is my Margaret and her parents in 1841?

So, I either have the d/c for the wrong Margaret Thomson, or I have found the wrong Margt McQueen with parents John McQueen and Mary Johnston. Possibly even the wrong d/c for David Thomson. Possibly wrong marriages ...

Address of Catherine when she married in 1879 is Barterholm which fits with 1871 census and addresses of the above death.

I would really appreciate some help sorting this conundrum out.

Apologies once again for the 2 Part question. 

[jennywren001]

On the 1871 census there's a Margaret McQueen born 1819, Bowmore, unmarried, living with her widowed sister-in-law called Mary - if we knew who Mary married maybe it would help place this Margaret with the correct parents. At least that would eliminate one set of parents for your Margaret.

David's not easy to find in 71 - there is a David Thomson, 50, labourer born Ireland lodging at High Church in Lanarkshire but he's describing himself as a widower...

I think the wee lassie is an 'examiner of shirting' - you've got to love the transcriptions they must be using OCR rather than humans.

I'd like to have a better look at the 10 'Mar* McQueens showing living in Argyllshire in 41 but there appears to be a problem with Freecen at the moment - I keep getting the 'server busy' notice.
Jen

[MonicaL]

Hi Ruskie and Jen 

There is a death or burial entry showing on the OPRs in Abbey Parish, Renfrewshire for a Matthew ROWON in 1839. Wondered whether this could be Margaret's first husband?

Monica

[MonicaL]

There is so much info there (great posts and summary, Ruskie  ) hope my responses not sounding bitty at this stage 

1871
4 Barterholm, Abbey Burgh
John Scott 23 b 1848 Ireland Gardener J lab
Margaret wife 23 b 1848 Paisley (ties in with the Margt daur age 3 in 1851 census b Kilarrow)
William Scott son 7months b Paisley
Margaret McQueen 50 b 1821, mother in law, born Islay, occupation: ag lab (slightly odd occupation)
Mary Thomson (Mary McQueen) 18 daur mothers name Margaret McQueen b Paisley occ:Washerwoman
Agnes Thomson age 14 daur b islay occ: exciseman of Stirling (extremely peculiar occupation for a 14 year old girl!)
Cathrine Thomson 11 daur b 1860 daur mothers name Margaret McQueen b Islay no occupation

[I have a birth for Agnes in 1856 but she was not with the family in 1861 - whereabouts unknown].

Have you checked the marriage for Margaret daughter to John Scott in 1870 I think? Going by this post here http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/LANARK/2001-06/0991679072  Thought it might give you further details on father David and mother Margaret, witnesses, addresses etc.

Guess also that in 1861 that you show above, Mary aged 12 is actuall Marg. (which often transcribes as Mary)?

Similarly, again a guess, Agnes b. 1856 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XY5Y-Y3B - I am thinking she is the Ann in 1861 showing aged 6 maybe (not accurate, but there was no Ann born to David and Margaret in 1855-6 was there?

Monica

[MonicaL]

David Thomson and Margaret McQueen look to have done a job lot on christenings in Jan 1855 - they look to show on SP (OPRs). Wondered whether any clues from witness' names etc?

John https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTJ3-4QJ
Margaret https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTJS-65X
William https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTJS-65J
Mary Ann https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTJ3-4Q2

This is a good site, you may have come across it already. Thinking here of seeing the number of the McQueen families around (not many) http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~steve/islay/opr/

Monica

[MonicaL]

Jen has already mentioned one possibility for David Thomson in 1871. There is another one I have across. a/try I think has this entry mistranscribed (sigh  ). It shows as:

David THOMAN, 45, patient, b. Ireland. Occupation: Labourer In Meachank(?). This entry shows at the Infirmary and Asylum in Paisley.  Could this be David ill and away from home on the night of the 1871 census maybe?

SP I think may have a David THOMSON, aged 45, in Paisley...but I haven't looked at the entry, so may be wrong about it.

Regarding the address details you have for a David Thomson's death that you have mentioned, there is an entry for a David Thomson in Barterholm on the 1875 Valuation Rolls on SP. Won't tell you much as you know, but thought maybe other names on the page (if connected to the family names you have) might help. Also it should show his occupation.

Monica

[jonn]

Hello All, there are certainly some strange going ons in this family, there are a couple of clues that could knit it all together as the same David Thomson, and Margaret McQueen alias Rowan.

Islay, is the clue you will not find many Thomson, births on that beautiful island well in that period anyway you have Catherine, and Agnes. However there is this particular birth Anne Thomson, born 02/Oct/1855. in kilarrow, Argyll, to parents David Thomson, and Margaret Rowan.

That is what i would describe as a possible teaser.

Regards,
Jonn.

[jonn]

Hello All,

The wee Anne Thomson, born 1855. died 1866. Kilarrow, Argyll.

This looks Like Margaret, as Mary, 1881. census.

Address Barterholm, Abbey, Renfrew.

Mary Thomson, Head, Housekeeper, W. age 60 years, F. born Islay, Argyll,
Mary Thomson, Daur, Bleachfield Worker, U. age 28 years, F. born Paisley, Renfrew. Handicap Deaf.
Sarah Irvine, Boarder, Bleachfield Worker, U. age 19 years, F. born Paisley, Renfrew.

Regards,
Jonn.