Author Topic: FLAVELL - born in 1846 but only on the 1871 census  (Read 1346 times)

Offline Trees

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FLAVELL - born in 1846 but only on the 1871 census
« on: Friday 26 January 18 10:54 GMT (UK) »
HELP  please can anyone find William Flavell on the 1851 or 1861 census.

WILLIAM appears on the  1871 Census RG10/3026 fo149 p31 born 1846 SEDGLEY
GRO index has a birth  1846  M Quarter in DUDLEY mother FLAVILL

Now comes the complicated bit.
On that census he is listed as son of Benjamin and Sarah FLAVELL but was he? ???
Benjamin FLAVELL married Sarah FLAVELL and his brother Edmund married Mary sister of Sarah.
Edmund died of cholera in 1849(08 September 1849 - Birmingham Journal ) his wife gave birth to a son Edmund after his father's death in 1850 then she died the same qtr as his birth he however was the only child of either couple baptised 16 Jun 1850 Pensnett, Staffordshire  to Edmund and Mary (Free Reg)
on the 1851 census HO107/2036 fo738 p29 however Edmund jnr is listed as son of Benjamin.  On the same census Benjamin is said to have a daughter Fanny but this girl appears on the next census  RG 9/2070 fo128 p33 with Benjamin and Sarah as Niece so was she also a child of Edmund and Mary had Benjamin and Sarah "adopted" Edmund's children? Then in 1871 William born 1846 suddenly appears as son of Benjamin and Sarah where was he in 1851 and 1861 and whose child was he? Benjamin's or Edmund's
It is a sad story that I would like to try and sort out with your help please
oh yes there was a 16 MNTH Maria FLAVELL buried in Lower Gornal abode  Commonside
Edmund snr was buried 07 Sep 1849 in Lower Gornal abode  Commonside so it looks like Maria was another of his children piling on the tragedy




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Offline avm228

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #1 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:12 GMT (UK) »
I found this quite hard to follow, sorry!

So you have:

Sep qtr 1841: Benjamin Flavell marries Sarah Flavell, Dudley

Dec qtr 1841: Edmund Flavell marries Mary Flavell, Dudley

Sep qtr 1842: Fanny Flavell, mmn Flavell, birth reg at Stourbridge

Mar qtr 1846: William Flavell is born - but to which couple?  Birth reg at Dudley.

08 Sep 1849: Edmund Flavell dies of cholera, aged 29.  Death reg at Stourbridge.

16 Jun 1850: Baptism of Edmund Flavell, son of Edmund & Mary, at Pensnett.  Birth reg Stourbridge.

Jun qtr 1850: Mary Flavell dies aged 28.  Death reg at Stourbridge.

1851 census (Pensnett): Benjamin & Sarah have “daughter” Fanny, 8, & “son” Edmond, 10mo.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

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Offline Trees

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #2 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:18 GMT (UK) »
correct then the censuses for Benjamin and Sarah
1851 HO107/2036 fo738 p29 EDMUND and FANNY children of B&S
1861 RG 9/2070 fo128 p33 FANNY niece of B&S
1871 RG10/3026 fo149 p31 William son of B&S

So where was WILLIAM 1851 and 1861 and whose child was he?
were all three children and little Maria children of EDMUND and Mary?
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline avm228

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #3 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:26 GMT (UK) »
Have you traced Mary Flavell after her husband’s death? If she remarried then she and William might appear under another surname in the intervening censuses.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline avm228

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #4 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:29 GMT (UK) »
There’s also a Cornelius Flavell mmn Flavell, birth reg Sep qtr 1846 Dudley, who may fit in somewhere?

Edit: ignore - seems to be a different family.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline Trees

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #5 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:34 GMT (UK) »
As I said she died having Edmund jnr which is why I think the children with Benjamin and Sarah were really Edmund and MARY'S...if only they had baptised their children it looks like the priest must have insisted on Edmond's baptism strange it doesn'tmention the parents being deceased
Cornelius is son of Joseph and Lucy but they are distant relations to the other four Flavells :o
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

For details of my research interests please see
mcmullin.me.uk
Also read the children a story from Story Time at the same web site.

Offline avm228

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #6 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:36 GMT (UK) »
Oh sorry, I didn’t see that Mary had died too.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline avm228

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #7 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:39 GMT (UK) »
Maria Flavell was baptised 4 June 1848 at Kingswinford, daughter of Edmond & Mary.
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

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Re: BORN IN 1846 BUT ONLY ON THE 1871 CENSUS
« Reply #8 on: Friday 26 January 18 11:40 GMT (UK) »
Sorry Trees, but it looks like the only way you are going to solve this conundrum if the children weren't baptised, is to get the birth certificates.  ;)
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