Author Topic: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster  (Read 819 times)

Offline Timbottawa

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"Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« on: Tuesday 12 February 19 06:29 GMT (UK) »
I'm trying to tie down precisely the location of my g-grandfather's pub, the "Duke of Ormond", at 17 Prince's St. (now Storey's Gate), Westminster.

According to the 1842 Directory, there were 3 public houses on Prince's St.: the Duke of Ormond, then the Red Lion, at 21, and the Prince's Head at 24.

I've attached an extract from the 1893/6 OS map (I expect I'll get into trouble about this, but the web-site says that images can be used for non-commercial purposes as long as I state: 'Reproduced with the permission of the National Library of Scotland').  Granted it is 50 years later, but there are still 3 pubs on the street.  Presumably the Red Lion is going to be the one in the middle, but is the Duke of Ormond the one at the northern end of the street or the southern? 

I cannot find online a map with house numbers.  My strong suspicion is that the D of O is at the southern end, as in the 1842 Directory, the Prince's Head is next door to Storey's Gate Coffee House, which is definitely at the northern end.  But I would welcome any confirmation - or contradiction.

Thanks
Boyle, Butler, Yarborough, Baldwin, Midwood, McHale, Carter, Noble, Kay, Raper, Greenwood, Swift

Offline ShaunJ

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 07:05 GMT (UK) »
The Prince's Head was at the Storey's Gate end of Princes Street
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline KGarrad

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 07:44 GMT (UK) »
Demolished between 1901 and 1911.
Numbering changed from #17 to #13 in 1856.

A potted history here:
https://pubshistory.com/LondonPubs/WestminsterStMargaret/DukeofOrmond.shtml
Garrad (Suffolk, Essex, Somerset), Crocker (Somerset), Vanstone (Devon, Jersey), Sims (Wiltshire), Bridger (Kent)

Offline Timbottawa

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 07:44 GMT (UK) »
Great - thanks for the confirmation.  What year is that Directory?
Boyle, Butler, Yarborough, Baldwin, Midwood, McHale, Carter, Noble, Kay, Raper, Greenwood, Swift


Offline Timbottawa

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 07:49 GMT (UK) »
Thanks KGarrad.  Yes, as far as I can tell, numbers 1 to about 11 were demolished in the 1870's to build the Royal Aquarium.  That means that the houses on the extreme right of the attached photo, while probably not the Duke of Ormond, were possibly next-door or next-door-but-one.

The Royal Aquarium and adjoining houses, including the Duke of Ormond, were demolished at the beginning of the 20th century for the construction of the Methodist Central Hall, which is the current building.
Boyle, Butler, Yarborough, Baldwin, Midwood, McHale, Carter, Noble, Kay, Raper, Greenwood, Swift

Offline ShaunJ

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 08:00 GMT (UK) »
Quote
What year is that Directory?

1851. It's in the file name!
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Timbottawa

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Re: "Duke of Ormond" P.H., Princes St., Westminster
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 12 February 19 08:14 GMT (UK) »
Ah yes - thanks!

My attention was caught by the occupant of no. 8, John Butler, boot and shoe maker.  Some 17 years or so later, a Henry Butler wooed Margaret McHale, daughter of the publican of the Duke of Ormond.  I have never been able to locate Henry in any census before 1881, so I wondered if he had actually been living, virtually, next-door, as early as 1851.

But it seems not.  John and his 61-year-old wife were living without children in 1851.
Boyle, Butler, Yarborough, Baldwin, Midwood, McHale, Carter, Noble, Kay, Raper, Greenwood, Swift