Did my great GM lie to six children their father was dead?

[Mart 'n' Al]

I am still trying to make sense of some of the mysteries  in my grandfather's  family.  Rootschat has helped me  and this time I  am interested in the marriage record of my great aunt Lavinia.

My grandfather's sister, Lavinia Leggett, was married in 1915. On her marriage record she states that her father was deceased.  However this conflicts with his death certificate 6 years later, and a newspaper article reporting it suggests otherwise.

I wonder if she was told 15 years earlier that her father had died. This marriage record suggests that either she was denying knowledge of him, which would surely be an offence or that she genuinely believed that he was dead. I'm interested in any comments, including what would have been a likely punishment for lying on an official document.

To provide a bit of background, some of which I  have mentioned on an earlier thread, but on a different aspect,

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=794673.0

her mother, Jane Adamson, my great great grandmother, was very briefly married to a Henry Thompson before being widowed in about 1890. She then took up with my grandfather's father, George Leggett, and had 5 children who took his name. When the sixth child, my grandfather Thomas Leggett was born in 1900 his birth certificate showed that his name was Thomas Thompson, the surname of his mother's first husband.

My theory is that Jane Adamson and George Leggett  had a rift while she was pregnant with my grandfather.  He does not appear on the 1901 Census, which has been annotated, "husband away", and does not appear with the family on the 1911 census. Any comments will be welcome.  I think there is substantial evidence to show that Jane and George had a big role while Jane was pregnant with my grandfather Thomas leading her to tell her children that George was dead.

One other thing to mention, is that on Thomas Leggett's birth certificate his father is named as George Thompson. This does make it possible that Jane had met somebody totally different by 1899 called George Thompson. Alternatively could there have been a misunderstanding by the registrar?

So, to summarise, did Lavinia Leggett really believe that her father was dead, or was she lied to by her mother?

Martin

[RJ_Paton]

1. You say your great great grandmother "took up with George leggett" - were they actually married.(If not any Registrar should record children under her previous married name - in Scotland it would be her maiden name). This would account for the Thomson surname but not the change in forenames although there is the possibility of human error creeping in at what may have been a stressful time.

2. Re Lavinia - her mother may have reverted to her status of being a widow which is much more respectable than an abandoned wife or partner - Lavinia may have grown up with that and believed that her mother was a widow. I doubt that saying her father was dead would count towards any offence as the Law requires that any falsehoods refer to pertinent facts which could otherwise affect the legitimacy of the marriage.

[jim1]

Haven't read the 17 pages from your link (can't think why).
So does Lavinia name a father on her marriage or does she just enter deceased?
Is it possible she believed her father to be Henry Thompson?

[Mart 'n' Al]

Falkyrn, I have no evidence that Jane married George.  In fact I think he was probably still married to his first wife who he seems to have deserted. 

These later events took place in Durham.

On Lavinia's 1892 BC it states George Leggett was the father, and Jane is described as "Jane Leggett, late Thompson, formerly Adamson".  The later births were very similar.  The new-borns showed no surname.

11:30 UPDATE:  Jim, Lavinia names George Leggett as her father. 

Martin

[Nanna52]

Martin both my great Aunt and uncle declared that their father was dead when they married in Melbourne in the early 1920’s.  He was alive and living in Tasmania.  He didn’t die until 1942.  They knew where he was as a brother lived near him.  I believe that after his poor treatment of them and their mother they wanted nothing to do with him.  He was dead to them.  He deserted them and I have his prison record for non payment of maintenance.

[Mart 'n' Al]

Thanks Nanna, it is 'nice to know' that it does happen, even if rather odd.  It does intrigue me and makes me want to know what might have happened after several children.  Even with other family members, we can't agree on whether they thy thought he was dead, or if they just disowned him.

Martin

[jim1]

On your grandad's birth cert cert. is the father listed as Thompson or Leggett?
It could be he wasn't George's son as there's no other reason why he shouldn't have been listed as Leggett.

[Kiltpin]

This marriage record suggests that either she was denying knowledge of him, which would surely be an offence or that she genuinely believed that he was dead. I'm interested in any comments, including what would have been a likely punishment for lying on an official document.

 

I don't know how any officialdom could prove "beyond all reasonable doubt" that she had lied. Surely it would come down to "he said / she said". "That's what I was told - that's what I've always believed" - who can gainsay that. 

If it is a punishable offence, then I know that I am guilty as well. A relative by marriage died and I had to register the death. He was the archetypal nonentity. He had achieved nothing in his life, neither working, nor private. On his death certificate I elevated him to Senior Managing Director with responsibility for all branches in the East of England.   

If ever questioned, I will of course deny everything.

Regards 

Chas

[Mart 'n' Al]

Jim, my grandfather's birth certificate lists his father as George Thompson. This is just another bit of the whole oddity. Surely the mother couldn't have got the name wrong? He grew up being known as Thomas Leggett. I don't think there is any doubt that Jane Adamson was able to read and write, so she would have noticed if the registrar had made a mistake. It's just all these mysteries together seem very odd.

Chas, I love your story.

Martin