Looking for Kirwan townland in County Wexford circa 1853

[oldohiohome]

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[mrk]

1./7.: Mary Cloak's mother, Mary Power Cloak, married William Hogan in the parish of Wexford -- the same parish that Mary Cloak married Martin Kirwan in 1848 -- so you make a very good point.

2.: I have looked for Martin Kirwan in Griffith's Valuation and need to do this again when AskAbout Ireland is next up and responding. As I recall from much earlier searches, there were several Martin Kirwan and there was no way of knowing if any of these records were for my Martin.

3.: Yes, that could be although my understanding is that godparents were traditionally siblings or siblings-in-law. I will have to look at the baptism records for the two Francis' and Patrick again and follow up on this lead.

4.: There were several churches in Wexford Town at various times. Unfortunately, the parish records at the NLI do not indicate anything more than "Wexford, Diocese of Ferns."

5.: The only information that had come down to us is that Martin Kirwan came from Wexford -- no mention of the county vs town let alone a street name or townland.

6.:  According to a cousin, Thaddeus is not related to my line. Nevertheless, it would be interesting to learn more about him at some point. Interestingly, based on an interment record from Our Lady of Mercy Church in Sarnia, Ontario, there was another Kirwan family in the 1880s. Family lore makes no mention of this family; however, I would be curious to know more about them.

I do not know why Martin Kirwan moved to Sarnia (sometime between 1856 and 1860 based on baptism records found for sons Martin and Joseph). There is no family lore regarding other family members living in Lambton County at the time or reason given for the move. The Grand Trunk Railway reached Sarnia in 1856 when the area was experiencing an oil boom and this might have been the motivation to move there although this is pure conjecture on my part.

8.: Family lore has it that my great grandmother had come across the name Grandcourt in her reading, had taken a fancy to it and so it was that her first son was named Patrick Grandcourt. There was a somewhat similar occurrence in the naming of her second son, Vernon.

[Wexflyer]

If I may say so, this thread is losing focus, with  points which have been answered on this board multiple times, or can be readily answered via Duckduckgo..

Case in point - how many churches in Wexford. This was addressed here (this board) previously.
For centuries previous to 1858, when the "twin churches" in Rowe and Bride Streets were consecrated, there was only a single Catholic church in Wexford.  This was not a regular parish church - there was none (before 1858). Instead, the parish priest had the use of the Franciscan friary - by curtesy.
The parish records are the oldest in Ireland, and stretch back to the 1680s, with only minor gaps.

In any case the number of churches is usually irrelevant. In parishes with more than one church, it is still normal to only have one set of parish registers (though there can be exceptions).

[Wexflyer]

Griffiths - there is more than just the published version, available on AskAboutIreland.

There are also the preceding Valuation office records, from before the published version, available online on the NAI genealogy pages.

For Wexford, Griffiths was published in 1853, and the preceding records cover approx. 1846-1852. Perfect timing match for this Kirwan family.

But there is no Martin Kirwan in the vicinity of Wexford Town. Nor variant spellings such as Kirwin or Kerevan either. These variants are present, and have to be searched individually. So if the family were in Wexford parish, which is clear, then there are three possibilities:
1. They were living in servant/staff accommodation, and so don't appear.
2. They were living with relatives, and so don't appear.
3. They were renting for less than a year at a time, and so don't appear.

[mrk]

Thanks for this, Wexflyer.

[Wexflyer]

I am afraid that I don’t buy the explanation for the appearance of Mary POOR as the mother's name on the 1853 baptism record for Patrick Kirwan.
I see where you are coming froom in trying to rationalize this. Poor and Power are indeed derived from a common root, but do you think a poor working man's family would possibly know this in the 1840s? Unlikely.
Now the priest might have known, but would it be on his mind? Again, unlikely.
And in 1848 Mary Cloak's, or Mary Hogan's (as the case may be) mother would have been know as Mrs Cloak, or Mrs Hogan for decades. Again, it seems to me to be unlikely that the priest would have been thinking of the French version of the maiden name for the grandmother, a name the grandmother had not used in decades!

[Wexflyer]

And what of the other Martin Kirwan, also having a child in Wexford, in 1851?

[Wexflyer]

Are the Canadian records civil registration, or church records, or both? If civil, do they show that Martin was litterate, or a marksman?

[Wexflyer]

Can someone please post the links for the
1824 Cloak - Power marriage
1830 Power - Hogan marriage.
Thanks