Donald Mackenzie of Urray, what was father's occupation?

[Rena]

I've finally settled on the below parents for my blacksmith Donald Mackenzie of Clyde Ironworks, Lanarkshire but born Urray in Ross & Cromarty.

I've been umming and ah-ing for years because in the 1851 Lanarkshire census, Clyde blacksmith Donald was aged 75 and in the 1851 Urray Census there was another Donald one year younger aged 74 but by choosing to stay on the land he became a pauper. 

I'd like opinions because there's a drawback, as Don was 7 yrs old when his father died and I can't find evidence that his mother remarried.  Thus there's a question of who paid for Don's blacksmith apprenticeship.     

The naming pattern checks: I knew the blacksmith had three definite sons  = John, Ken and Duncan, there was a gap between John and Ken so I have a possible Alex (an engineer) but altho Alex's death cert gave the correct father's name of Donald, the mother was given as Agnes instead of Ann  I think the signatory took a stab at giving one of his older daughters names instead of the youngest daughter Ann.


Donald's Parents:
John Mackenzie and Anne Robertson. All children found were born in Urray, Black Isle.  Not one baptism record shows John's occupation but judging from the places his children were born he did a lot of gadding about, thus could be a farmhand on a large estate, or another occupation that I haven't thought of.   Mary's birth was a bit late for the parenting pattern, so I checked the weather conditions and it seems there was an early and long frosty winter.

I'm questioning the occupation because, where would a farm labourer's widow get the money to pay for Donald's apprenticeship?

JANNET Mackenzie        born 17 April 1765 in Balloan
ALEXANDER Mackenzie  born 14 July 1770 in Knockroy,
MARY Mackenzie           born 27 Aug 1771 Urray
DONALD Mackenzie       born   9 July 1775 in Belloan
JOHN Mackenzie            b 26 June 1782 in Laigh Fairburn (posthumous)

I've always had a notion that my Donald was linked to a John Mackenzie of Strathgarve, who put money into and helped build and design the Clyde Ironworks company.  Maybe Donald's mother became housekeeper to Strathgarve and it was he who organised the apprenticeship.  Anpther thing that struck me was that all of Donald's sons became managers of companies at very early ages, which also makes me think there was some clout behind the family.

Please feel free to poke holes in my train of thought. 

[DonM]

Rena,

John McKenzie's TD is in SP, if your curious and willing to spend 10 credits.

But the problem with this thought is he lived west of Dingwall and between there and the Peninsula there would maybe a couple hundred Mc/MacKenzie's.  That being said the Peninsula where the family lived on was held for the most part by McKenzie's (4 of them).

Perhaps Donald's father was a Blacksmith or an uncle which his how he learned his trade. 

Then there is a Donald, the blacksmith in Dingwall in 1840 the record is in the NAS.

Kirk Session Minutes might mention his father or himself.  And then the newspaper archives but I am unsure Dingwall had a paper then. 

Stay safe...

Don

[Rena]

Rena,

John McKenzie's TD is in SP, if your curious and willing to spend 10 credits.

But the problem with this thought is he lived west of Dingwall and between there and the Peninsula there would maybe a couple hundred Mc/MacKenzie's.  That being said the Peninsula where the family lived on was held for the most part by McKenzie's (4 of them).

Perhaps Donald's father was a Blacksmith or an uncle which his how he learned his trade. 

Then there is a Donald, the blacksmith in Dingwall in 1840 the record is in the NAS.

Kirk Session Minutes might mention his father or himself.  And then the newspaper archives but I am unsure Dingwall had a paper then. 

Stay safe...

Don

Hello Stranger.  thanks for stopping by.   FYI I have spent a small fortune on scotlandspeople and prior to that, I bought from scotsorigins (britishorigins) who started the enterprise but eventually lost out

I think the isolation policy has brought you to a state of "stir crazy" because you've mentioned the wrong century - I'm now researching the Parish of Urray in the 18th century, not the 1800s. All the places mentioned are in Urray's church register on the Black Isle, ROC, opposite Inverness.

In 1841 census "my" Donald, a blacksmith, was working in Old Monkland, Lanarkshire and I learned he was from Urray in the 1851 Old Monkland census when he was aged 75 years old - he died not long afterwards.

If, as you suggest,  Donald's father was a blacksmith, he must have been upwardly mobile accepting better paid jobs which would answer the question of why the children were all born in different places. 

Interesting that you mention the four Mackenzies.  My daughter took me to a medium a couple of decades ago who mentioned four "farms" and an ancestor named "Colin".  There's not a sniff of a Colin or an inherited farm -  yet 

I believe the John Mackenzie of Strathgarve d1788 to be the younger brother of William McK of Highfield

[Ruskie]

Just a quick comment ... the names Ann and Agnes can be interchangeable. 

[Skoosh]

Rena, have you checked the Mackenzie's in the Urray Poor Register 1865-1918? I have it if you need a look-up?

Skoosh.

[Rena]

Just a quick comment ... the names Ann and Agnes can be interchangeable. 

Thanks Ruskie,I appreciate your input.
 I hesitated to grasp at that straw because in this branch of my family there are no Parish baptism/birth records for Alexander and it's such a common name there's a drawback when a groom marries in the bride's parish = which bride and which parish = a very expensive exercise.  Buying a potential will is very expensive, especially when the darned things don't furnish any clues, exept "I leave to my dear wife". no name  and no list of children's names.

[Rena]

Rena, have you checked the Mackenzie's in the Urray Poor Register 1865-1818? I have it if you need a look-up?

Skoosh.

Thanks for stopping by to offer help Skoosh, it's appreciated. I don't have any datasets - I once enquired about buying the Urray Muster Roll of the 1790s but was quoted a price of £500  (ouch, ouch, ouch).   If the start date of 1865 that you've typed for the Poor Register is correct, then it's too late, as Don's father John would be dead by then and Don himself died in the 1850s.

If the start date is 1765 then there's a possibility that John & Anne McK might be registered and I would be really obliged if you could find the time to have a look.

[Skoosh]

Made a hash of that Rena, 1865-1918, it's the quarantine! 

There is an Ann Mackenzie, wife of Alex at Balloan age 42. July 8 1887 b.Lochcarron. Wholly disabled, her husband a ploughman to Mr Gunn, Balloan, died in the District Assylum 1887, have you tried a look at the Fairburn Estate Tenants? https://fairburn-estate.co.uk/?page_id=203  A great read anent the Gairloch Mackenzie's is "Pigeon Holes of Memory!" the life & times of Dr John MacKenzie 1803-1886, edited by Christina Byam Shaw, pub, Constable. It's £20 but check online. He was a brother of Gairloch & was sent to the Edinburgh Medical School then joined the army.A thick 440 pages, much about the different Mackenzie branches of his time & clearances etc.

Bests,
Skoosh.

[Rena]

Made a hash of that Rena, 1865-1918, it's the quarantine! 

There is an Ann Mackenzie, wife of Alex at Balloan age 42. July 8 1887 b.Lochcarron. Wholly disabled, her husband a ploughman to Mr Gunn, Balloan, died in the District Assylum 1887, have you tried a look at the Fairburn Estate Tenants? https://fairburn-estate.co.uk/?page_id=203  A great read anent the Gairloch Mackenzie's is "Pigeon Holes of Memory!" the life & times of Dr John MacKenzie 1803-1886, edited by Christina Byam Shaw, pub, Constable. It's £20 but check online. He was a brother of Gairloch & was sent to the Edinburgh Medical School then joined the army.A thick 440 pages, much about the different Mackenzie branches of his time & clearances etc.

Bests,
Skoosh.

Thanks for the extra research Skoosh.  I took a different line to you and decided that as Mary was an unusual M'kenzie given name, that I'd follow her and I see that a Mary Mckenzie, young enough to be John's daughter and old enough to be blacksmith Donald's older sibling, got married early in the 1800s and became Mrs Thom in Old Monkland, Lanarkshire, where Donald, the blacksmith lived with his sons.  Unfortunately when the 1841 census appeared Donald aged 65, was on it but old woman Mrs Mary Thom didn't appear in any freecen census (I'm getting confused and stir crazy - at least I think she vanished lol )