James Dale

[JANICELEEDALE]

I thought I was more than a beginner but I am forced to ask for the higher wisdom of you lovely people. I CANNOT progress James Dale. 5th GGF. I believe he is linked to Helmsley, Yorkshire and had a son William Dale 30 Nov 1785 • , Helmsley, York, England my 4th GGF. Most of the hints keep going to Bartholomew Dale but I really don't think that is right. It seems they have carried on naming after the previous father with James, William and Thomas so I just can't buy Bartholomew. I really need help please. Thank you in advance. Janice Lee  Dale

[ColC]

I’m not sure if this is the family you refer to.

James mother noted as Margaret only on Margaret’s record below.

Baptisms Helmsley

Margaret Dale   2 Mar 1772
James Dale   8 Nov 1773
Bartholomew Dale 14 Sep 1776
Margaret Dale   10 Feb 1778
Thomas Dale   16 Mar 1781
Ann Dale           15 Feb 1782
William Dale   30 Nov 1785
Charles Dale   23 Nov 1786
Bartle Dale   2 Aug 1789

If the above is correct the record you mention is possible but if they followed the English naming pattern I would have thought James would be more likely to be the father.

James Dale   26 Jun 1743   , Helmsley, York, England   Bartholomew

So this might be an option.
James Dale   3 Jul 1737   Husthwaite With Carlton,York,England   James

Colin

[ColC]

James Dale to Margaret Beecroft
Marriage 30 Jul 1770
Saint Leonard, New Malton, Yorkshire

Colin

[JANICELEEDALE]

Hey Col C, don't know if this will work because it is the only reply I can click on. I agree, James is the obvious, but then Bartholemew is in the children. What is the internet link you've used? thanks J

[ColC]

The records posted are on Ancestry.

The name Bartholomew does seem to be a regular feature of the Dale family and I think as the name Dale goes back at Helmsley to the 1570s, it is likely that James was born there, so either his father was Bartholomew or the record for his father as not survived.

It could simply be that James & Margaret used their names for the first two children before the naming pattern began, if there was one?

Colin

[JANICELEEDALE]

Thanks Colin, I guess I'll press ahead, wait and see if I get a DNA match through them. cheers jenny

[JANICELEEDALE]

As an added conundrum.... it is HIGHLY unusual in those time for a couple to have sooo many children before they marry. Bartholomew and Ann had 7 children before they married in 1769. James Dale was their first. Can someone think about this for me because I feel VERY unsure this is the right combination. HELP please.

[JANICELEEDALE]

PS this child's name is especially strange 'Bartholomew Frogley Dale (1749-) ' as I found where an Ann married a Bartholomew Frogley. Is there a cross over. Did Ann marry twice. HELP please

[ColC]

Baptisms Helmsley father Bartholomew

James Dale   26 Jun 1743
Bartholomew Dale   24 Feb 1744
Elizabeth Dale   12 Feb 1746
Margret Dale   21 Jun 1752
Martha Dale   9 Oct 1757
Frances Dale   8 Apr 1760

My guess is that this is the son of Bartholomew 1744 who married Ann Jackson 30 Oct 1769

John Dale   16 Apr 1770

Colin