Totally stuck! William Fallows and Phoebe Green

[heywood]

Yes we realise what you are trying to find and in turn we are trying to help. It might seem a bit odd but collecting other information, sometimes helps.
I have looked on Family Search and https://indiafamily.bl.uk/UI/Home.aspx but sadly can’t see anything there.
I came across John Fallows and was hoping that there may be a connection to William.
Although John has 3 wives/partners in censuses, I can only see that marriage quoted and unfortunately can’t find it online. There might have been a father for John which may then lead to his birth etc. The family might have had Ashton u Lyne connections with both men being there.
Of course, they may have no family relationship at all.
That’s the explanation. 

[Gibel]

I looked at William’s marriage entry and find it strange. In my experience the father’s name is written in the box under father and dead or deceased written in the occupation. It makes me wonder if he didn’t know his father’s name or was possibly illegitimate.

[heywood]

This might exclude John Fallows - 1861 2998/94/23
He gives Barbados as his birth place.
That is also on 1881 census but crossed out - Barbados India.

[wivenhoe]

Lancashire Parish Online Project
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html.....marriages.....FALLOWES...1839 +/-   5 YEARS

St Mary, Oldham, Lancashire, England
1 Sep 1834
William HARDACRE - Joiner, Oldham
Betty FALLOWS - (X), Spinster, Oldham
Witness: Abram JACKSON; Edward TRAVIS
Married by J. FALLOWFIELD

15 Sep 1839
James STANSFIELD - (X), full, Engineer, Bachelor, Oldham
Hannah FALLOWS - (X), full, Spinster, Oldham
Groom's Father: Charles STANSFIELD
Witness: Abram. JACKSON; John JACKSON
Married by  W. COCKCROFT Offg. Mins.

17 Mar 1839
William FALLOWS - full, Spinner, Bachelor, Oldham
Phebe GREEN - (X), full, Widow, Oldham
Bride's Father: George TAYLOR
Witness: Abram. JACKSON; James HAUGHTON
Married by  J. FALLOWFIELD

27 Jun 1842
Thomas TAYLOR - (X), full, Twister, Widower, Becket Meadow
Mary FALLOWS - (X), full, Spinster, Glodwick
Groom's Father: Thomas TAYLOR
Bride's Father: James FALLOWS
Witness: Abram JACKSON; Ralph JACKSON
Married by Thomas LOWE

27 Oct 1844
Joseph BIRD - (X), Full, Labourer, Bachelor, Glodwick
Mary FALLOWS - (X), Full, Spinster, Glodwick
Groom's Father: John BIRD, Labourer
Bride's Father: John FALLOWS, Farmer
Witness: Abram. JACKSON; John JACKSON
Married by Daniel WALLER Curate

Baptisms   FALLOWS William / Phoebe

12 Dec 1841 St Michael and All Angels, Ashton under Lyne, Lancashire, England
James FALLOWS - [Child] of William Fallows & Phoebe
Abode: Town      Occupation: Grinder      Baptised by: C. J. QUIRK

8 Jan 1843 St Michael and All Angels, Ashton under Lyne, Lancashire, England
Henry FALLOWS - [Child] of William Fallows & Phobe
Abode: Town      Occupation: Grinder     Baptised by: J. HANDFORTH, Curate

[heywood]

I looked at William’s marriage entry and find it strange. In my experience the father’s name is written in the box under father and dead or deceased written in the occupation. It makes me wonder if he didn’t know his father’s name or was possibly illegitimate.

The previous entry shows ‘both dead’ so perhaps it was just recorded thus.

[wivenhoe]

Can you describe the family you are seeing in 1861......names, ages, location....
 
"...In 1861 he is with wife Phoebe, and a lot of assorted family, in Ashton"



Can you describe the family you are seeing in 1871......names, ages, location....

"...1871 he's with Phoebe, who seems to have added a few years to her age, and another Phoebe, a grandaughter, in Dukinfield, Manchester"

[blueva]

Hi Wifenhoe
1861 census
121 back Cambridge st Ashton under lyne Lancashire
William Fallows Head mar 44 cotton card grinder ? East Indies
Phoebe Fallows wife 43  - Dukinfield Cheshire
Elizabeth Fallows unmar 16 cotton frame tenter Ashton under lyne LAncashire
Henry Fallows unmar 14 cotton piecer AUL
Hannah Fallows.  9 scholar AUL

1871 census
106 Astley st Dukinfield Cheshire

William Fallows head mar 54 grinder cotton mill East Indies British subject
Phebe Fallows wife 67? - Dukinfield Cheshire
phebe Green granddaughter 11 Ashton under lyne Lancashire

Thanks for your interest Blueva

[ThrelfallYorky]

Sorry, I didn't go into a great deal of detail about my initial findings, as I realised you were seeking his origins, but I think most of us thought that the "Phoebe" name might help us to find other family members, and that in turn may lead us to discover his birthplace and possibly parentage. As you've realised, we found a lot of possibilities for family - "Lancs Parish Clerks" is a very useful site. The "East Indies / West Indies" problem is difficult. I certainly wondered about navy or army links, but couldn't find any. The one "Ireland" census entry does however seem to be linked, doesn't it?
As we build up a network of relatives for him, we may be able to find his birthplace, but it's something that we may not actually find, equally. But we'll keep trying.

[blueva]

Hi I think the Ireland box on census was a tick for Ireland or foreign parts and was mis transcribed as Ireland . As all others were East Indies. Thanks for your time and trouble to date Blueva