Armstrong family Belfast

[Kk7]

There are about 20 Armstrong gravestones in Broughshane 1st Presbyterian graveyard.  I don’t see one to William and his wife Lizzie. However when he married his townland was Pollee and there are 4 graves which mention Armstrong & Pollee:

Armstrong in memory of William Armstrong, Pollee, died July 8 1901 his wife Nancy died April 17 1927 their daughters Agnes died Sep 1 1943 Sarah died Jan 15 1949 Mary died Feb 10 1953 Catherine died June 1 1953 and their son Samuel died July 7 1955

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Broughshane/Pallee/928259/


Erected in memory of John Armstrong late of Pollee who depd this life 21st Feb 1825 aged 59 years Also his grandson Andrew who departed this life on the 1st of October 1834, aged 9 years Also his wife Sarah who died on the 1st of December 1841 aged 74 years

Erected by James Armstrong of Pollee, to the memory of his beloved father John who departed this life on the 5th August 1849 aged 64 years Also the above named James Armstrong who died 13th January 1910 Also his wife Margaret who died 13th January 1910

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Broughshane/Pallee/928273/

Erected by James Armstrong of Pollee to the memory of his beloved mother Jenny Ann who departed this life on the 14th June 1849 aged 62 years Also his son William died on Monday 20th January 1908 aged 40 years

Please could you tell me how I could find the graves? Many thanks for the census, now having the time I can indeed see that these may be Williams family..

[Elwyn Soutter]

Please could you tell me how I could find the graves? Many thanks for the census, now having the time I can indeed see that these may be Williams family..

I assume you are asking how to find the transcriptions? (The graves themselves should be in the graveyard in Main Street Broughshane, unless someone has been up to no good). The transcriptions are on the Braid graveyard site:

http://www.thebraid.com/genealogy.aspx

[Kk7]

  yes indeed I am. Thankyou for the link.

[scotmum]

And in case you are unfamiliar with the area:

https://www.townlands.ie/antrim/antrim-lower/skerry/pollee/

as well as nearby, albeit not adjoining

https://www.townlands.ie/antrim/antrim-lower/knockboy/

the latter being immediately behind First Broughshane.

[Kk7]

Many thanks! Am familiar having spent many many holidays and family visits in ni    however much more familiar with Belfast / ballynahinch and Newry than above

[Kk7]

As William is listed as born in Scotland in the above census.... Are there any records that I could seek out if Scots entering Ireland. I estimate William was born approx 1867 as is 44 in the 1911 census.
I have tried to look for Elizabeth's birth in Kildare 1867 also as they are the same age to father Joseph ward.... Invisible!!!

P.s @scotsmum your Gordon Getty theory is very intriguing he seems also to have disappeared!

[Elwyn Soutter]

No there are no passenger records for travel from Ireland to Scotland. It was then (and still is) a short domestic journey and records have never been kept for that.

William & Nancy were married in Ireland on 5th December 1865. They were back in Ireland on 3rd April 1870 when their daughter Mary (Minnie) was born at Pollee. So William has to have been born 1866 – 1869. There are 41 William Armstrong birth on Scotlandspeople for those 4 years. If you gambled and went just for 1867 & 1868 there’s 23.  So if you have about £30 to spare you could just work your way through them to see if you can find the right birth.

Normally when people went from Ireland to Scotland it was typically for labouring work, ship building or coal mining, all of which were in the Forth-Clyde belt or Ayrshire.  So you can often exclude families in places like Galashiels and Berwick (which appear in the 23). But with William coming from a farming background and returning to farming maybe not.

No point looking for the family in any Scottish census as they weren’t there long enough.

I looked at births in Kildare 1864 to 1870 but did not seen any Eliza or any un-named females whose father was Joseph. So can’t assist with her origins either. Sorry.

[scotmum]

Do be aware when reviewing all our suggetions, that the Armstrong name was fairly common in the area. For instance, in neighbouring Elginny (and variations) townland in 1858, there was another William Armstrong who married a Nancy Graham/s. She lived in Pollee.

Also, remember that, given the chap who is potentially 'your' William twice stated he was born in Scotland, his being in Ireland and apparently having at times lived in and had some sort of association with the Broughshane area (an area with strong links to Scotland), could have been for any number of reasons, not necessarily that he had a parent/s who was/were from or lived there.

Have you gone down, or considered going down, the DNA route at all?

[scotmum]

Just a thought on Elizabeth/Lizzie and the County Kildare link.

It was not uncommon for children to be born in one place and live later in another or several other places. If they moved from their birth area whilst very young, they could have grown up genuinely believing an area they merely lived in for a time was where they were born, and so entered this, as adults, in documents. Kildare, for example, had a large military training camp, so men/families often spent time there/in the area from elsewhere then moved on.

Also re  Elizabeth/Lizzie, it was more usual in timescale for marriages to take place in the bride's parish/area. She and William, however, married in the area he was living (she giving Whiteabbey      https://www.townlands.ie/antrim/belfast-lower/carnmoney/whiteabbey/ ?  as her address at time of marriage). Did she ever have any links to the Broughshane area as well?

It is also noticeable that she did not give an occupation for Patrick correction, Joseph, her father. Was he her father, or a name to hide that her mother was a Ward and unmarried? If her father, was he even still alive or had he died whilst she was young and she never knew his occupation?

In the 1901 census, there are no other obvious Ward entries in County Antrim with a birthplace of County Kildare. There are about (including Lizzie), 15 married females, aged 34 +/- 5 yrs living in County Antrim but with birthplace of County Kildare - not too big a number to perhaps check through their marriages to see if any were Ward to their maiden name with a father Joseph.

Lots to ponder on.