catherine mc bryde

[Rosinish]

It would be an idea to do a TIMELINE to highlight all the contradicting info. then you can begin to dissect it.

Can you also give all info. included on any certs. you have as clues can be often be found in added info?


Annie

[orkrad]

 Thanks Rosinish  Great idea  Hadnt considered a timeline. Have lots of certificates and paper docs and Legacy Family tree printouts and DNA.  A time line sounds like a good opportunity to collate all this disparate infomation. Regards Orkrad.

[Forfarian]

It looks to me as if Catherine must have got a bit muddled about the given names of her parents and grandparents.

I haven't previously come across Bridget being used as a synonym for Elizabeth/Betty.

I agree with Rosinish - a timeline with all the available details would be a good way to go.

[rosie17]

Would agree with Forfarian about Catherine getting a bit mixed up with the names of parents /grandparents
I'm assuming this is the death for Catherine's mother as Elizabeth ?
Elizabeth Tolan death 1900 Port  Glasgow age 56 years mother maiden name Gorman
Elizabeth Devine death 1900 Port Glasgow age 56 years mother maiden name Gorman
Reference number 574/4 Scotland's People

Rosie

[Rosinish]

Sorry, an error, was only meant to modify my previous post but was too late 

Annie

[orkrad]

 Yes Rosie You have the correct details re Catherine's mother. She was Elizabeth TOLAN/TOLLIN.her married name was DIVINE.  Her age is definitely wrong as she was10 yrs old in 1841 , Elizabeth's mother was Bridget TOLON/TOLAN ms GORMAN.

Catherine's mother Elizabeth / Bridget ?  had two children with her husband Charles DIVINE. She reverted to her maiden name when widowed and is back in the family home at 40 Church street Port Glasgow  in the 1861 census.  She had two further  sons  to whom she gave the surname TOLAN. The children appear to have no statutory birth certs and are born  circa 1866 and 1868.  No father's name appears on their baptism certificates.  One of the sons is my direct ancestor .

This is a most confusing family and I think there are some family secrets  yet to be discovered !. Orkrad

[rosie17]

Do you have the marriage for Elizabeth and Charles Devine and have you tried looking for a birth certificate for the 2 sons by just putting a Christian name in ?

Rosie

[rosie17]

Just answered my own question on one of the births you might want to look at this one
Edward Toly birth 4/4/1866 Port Glasgow  SP statutory records
Mother Elizabeth Toly

Baptism for Edward Tolan has the same birth date 4/4/1866 St John's Port Glasgow
Mother Elizabeth Tolan

Rosie

[orkrad]

 Thanks once again Rosie. You are a super sleuth. Will check out the Edward TOLY birth  record.
 As regards the marriage record. I have the following : on 31st December 1852 Charles DIVINE ( boilermaker) and Elizabeth TORRENCE both residing in Port-Glasgow are booked in order to proclamation for marriage. (2)  These are records from the Church of Scotland and I have been told by LDS that it is possible that those performed by RC clergy might not be recorded as performed.  I am reasonably sure that the name TORRENCE is an interpretation of TOLINS/TOLAN . The bride was Irish and I am not sure the family spoke English. She was born  circa  1831  and appears in the 1841 census aged 10. Regards Orkrad