Joel & Joseph Jackman from Gt Bedwyn

[kevsters]

My 4th Gt grandfather, Joel Jackman born to  John Jackman & Ann (unknown surname) in Gt Bedwyn 1784, died 1828.  From the  parish records he had 5 children with 'Millicent' between 1813 & 1828.  However, I am unable to find a marriage.

I have found six siblings for Joel,  one of whom was Joseph, born in Gt Bedwyn 1786.  I have found a marriage between Joseph & Millicent Church in Burbage 1812 and baptism records for 2 sons, James 1814 & William 1823.  I am unable to find a death/burial for Joseph.

However onn both James' & William's marriage record their father is down as Joel!

Can anyone help clarify
Thanks,
Kevin

[rosie99]

I wonder whether it has been mistranscribed, Joseph is often shortened to Josh

[ColC]

This is posted on Ancestry but nothing to substantiate it, other than a Wiltshire Badge.

Joseph Jackman
Birth   1786 - Death   1828

However this on family search.

Joel Jackman
Burial 22 January 1828
Burbage, Wiltshire, England
Birth 1785 

Colin

[kevsters]

Thanks for your replies.  I have looked at other Family Trees and they appear to be as confused as I am (some more so   )

I do remember someone suggesting that Joseph died young and Joel took his name but I can't find that now.  Whilst that could explain why I can't find a marriage record for Joel it doesn't explain why there are 2 baptism records with Joseph named as the father.

Will keep looking - something may turn up! 

[ColC]

This might help?

These are the children on Ancestry. Baptised Great Bedwyn to John, & Ann

Thomas Jackman   11 Mar 1781         
Joel Jackman           6 Jun 1784         
Joseph Jackman           13 Aug 1786         
Ann Jackman           10 Apr 1789         
Elizabeth Jackman   15 Apr 1792         
Thomas Jackman   1 Feb 1795         

Although there are Wiltshire burials on Ancestry, prior to 1812, including some at Great Bedwyn, which names the parents, there are none for John & Ann, yet I guess there eldest son Thomas presumably died.
Below names above born 1781 – 1795, only one burial from 1813 but no parents listed.

Thomas Jackman   about 1795   25 Jan 1818   Great Bedwyn   presume son of John

Plus as posted Joel Jackman   about 1785   22 Jan 1828   Burbage   

However there are these baptisms?

James Jackman   30 Oct 1814   Burbage   Joseph,Millecent   
William Jackman   18 May 1823   Burbage   Joseph,Millicent   

Charles Jackman   14 Mar 1813   Great Bedwyn   Joel,Milicent   
Thomas Jackman   29 Jun 1817   Burbage   Joel,Millicent   
Ann Jackman           20 May 1820   Burbage   Joel,Millicent   
Sarah Jackman           27 Feb 1825   Burbage   Joel,Milleysent   

Colin

[ColC]

The only marriage parish record I can find for the children of Joel & Millicent, is the youngest daughter.

Sarah Jackman of Milton, married Thomas Eastman 26 Oct 1848 Milton Lilborne, Wiltshire, father noted as Joel a Farmer, witnesses William & Louisa Jackman & Anna Church.

Colin

[kevsters]

Hi Colin,

Thanks for taking the time to look. 

What you have found tallies with the info I have found.  There is also a daughter, Joannah, born 1828.

The baptisms of Joel's kids has his occupation as a sawyer, carpenter, carpenter, Labourer, Labourer

On Sarah's wedding record I also read it as farmer but looking again  maybe it's Labourer? 

On Joannah's wedding records it states Sawyer on her 1st marriage &  deceased on the 2nd

Millicent had 2 further daughters (1834 & 1836) whom were both baptised in 1848 where Mum is declared a widow! These 3 appear in the 1841 & 1851 census

As for "Joseph's" kids: the marriage of James to Louise James states Joel as father and a farmer!.  I haven't found the marriage between William & Rachel other than a picture posted to someone's tree where it states Joel as the father.

Kevin

[ColC]

On Sarah's wedding record I also read it as farmer but looking again  maybe it's Labourer? 

I haven't found the marriage between William & Rachel other than a picture posted to someone's tree where it states Joel as the father.

Kevin

I do believe that Joel on Sarah's marriage is a Farmer, if you look at the marriage below written by the same person the word Labourer is written on the record.

I also think that the witness William is her brother and Louisa the second witness is his wife.

This on Ancestry seems to check out, see 1851 census:

William Jackman
Spouse   Louise James
Father   Joseph Jackman
Mother   Millicent Church
Children   Francis
Birth   18 May 1823 Burbage, Wiltshire, England
Death   Dec 1909 Lymington, Hampshire.

I think Joel born 1784 was the one to die at a young age, as did Thomas 1781. There are no other records for Joel to suggest he survived. Maybe Joseph adopted the name for whatever reasons.

Colin

[kevsters]

Hi Colin,

I agree it probably is farmer - which seems a little strange since Joel was down as carpenter/sawyer/labourer on all the baptisms and in the 1841 & 1851 census Millicent as "Carpenter's widow".

I agree regarding the witnesses and that is why I had included this record in my tree.

Whilst Joel dying early & Joseph taking his name would clear some discrepancies it then throws up other questions e.g. one would then presume the Joel burial is actually Joseph in 1828 but in all the kids marriages the father appears still be alive apart from Joannah's 2nd marriage!
There is a burial of a Joel Jackman in Burbage 1828 which tallies with the last child being, Joanah, being born 1828.

I found 1841 to 91 census' for Thomas with wife Jane (Randall) & death for Thomas in 1895. I haven't marriage details so no father's details to confirm it is my Thomas but birth details match

Thanks again
Kevin