ERNST - Brickwall

[LucasKernan]

I am tracing my 2nd great grandparents:
Frederick Ernst born February 1824 in Saxony, Germany

Clementine Minnie née Drodfeldt born in August 1836 Saxony, Germany (I can’t prove her maiden surname)

They came to the US in 1872:

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=7488&h=15035364&ssrc=pt&tid=176525003&pid=392307156891&usePUB=true&\_gl=1\*jzu0eq\*\_ga\*MTExMTcyMTYyMC4xNjY2NTk2Njcy\*\_ga\_4QT8FMEX30\*MTY2NzQ1MzAwMy44LjEuMTY2NzQ3Mzk0Ni41OS4wLjA.

Here is the immigration record (familysearch.org)

Date: Nov 1872

Ship: Canada

Ernst F (Ernst Frederick) Age: 48 (born 1824) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FK3T

Ernst C (Ernst Clementina) Age:36 (born 1836) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FK3Y

The next page continues with the children of the couple as:

Ernst Ann (Ernst Annie) Age: 11 (Born 1861) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FK3B

Ernst  Age:10 (born: 1862)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FK31

Ernst Meta (Ernst Clara Meta) Age:7 (born: 1865)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FKQM

Ernst Cleman (Ernst Clement) Age: 5 (born: 1867) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FKQ9

There are 2 infants with no information:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FKQ3

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVR3-FKQS

The birthdates are not accurate (estimates).

1880 Census

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MN8R-BJN

The Ernst family is listed on the 1880 US Census.

Frederick died in 1901 and Clementine died in 1915. They died both in New Jersey.

More information:

Frederick Ernst

1880 US Census

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/36478086:6742

1890 United States census

The United States census of 1890 was taken beginning June 2, 1890, but most of the 1890 census materials were destroyed in 1921 when a building caught fire and in the subsequent disposal of the remaining damaged records. It determined the resident population of the United States to be 62,979,766—an increase of 25. 5 percent over the 50,189,209 persons enumerated during the 1880 census. The data reported that the distribution of the population had resulted in the disappearance of the American frontier

1900 US Census

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/66104040:7602

Death Record Index of New Jersey - 1901

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=61260&h=72533&tid=&pid=&queryId=6ac7f0c68edca26a13f680c7b62496ea&usePUB=true&_phsrc=TET10&_phstart=successSource&_gl=1*18r8scv*_ga*MTExMTcyMTYyMC4xNjY2NTk2Njcy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NzUyNzE5NC45LjEuMTY2NzU1NTA1NC41My4wLjA.

Clementine Ernst

New Jersey, U.S., Wills and Probate Records, 1739-1991

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=8796&h=1670560&tid=176525003&pid=392307156891&queryId=baca6cb960bef725f3b3d3acc7993cf3&usePUB=true&_phsrc=TET24&_phstart=successSource

1880 US Census

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?dbid=6742&h=36201767&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=7884&_gl=1*1hcyz6r*_ga*MTExMTcyMTYyMC4xNjY2NTk2Njcy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NzUyNzE5NC45LjEuMTY2NzU1NjM5OS41MC4wLjA

1890 US Census

The United States census of 1890 was taken beginning June 2, 1890, but most of the 1890 census materials were destroyed in 1921 when a building caught fire and in the subsequent disposal of the remaining damaged records. It determined the resident population of the United States to be 62,979,766—an increase of 25. 5 percent over the 50,189,209 persons enumerated during the 1880 census. The data reported that the distribution of the population had resulted in the disappearance of the American frontier

1900 US Census

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?dbid=7602&h=66104041&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=7884&_gl=1*1r9dwlv*_ga*MTExMTcyMTYyMC4xNjY2NTk2Njcy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NzUyNzE5NC45LjEuMTY2NzU1NjQyNi4yMy4wLjA.

1905 New Jersey State Census

https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?dbid=61557&h=767278&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=7884&_gl=1*169zt82*_ga*MTExMTcyMTYyMC4xNjY2NTk2Njcy*_ga_4QT8FMEX30*MTY2NzUyNzE5NC45LjEuMTY2NzU1NjU1NS41OC4wLjA

1910 US Census

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/16700670:7884?tid=176525003&pid=392307156891&queryId=baca6cb960bef725f3b3d3acc7993cf3&_phsrc=TET24&_phstart=successSource

I cannot find any marriage, exact birthplace, or proof. I know that they married in 1857. There are online Family Tree which say that they were born in Kamenz but I have confirmed that it is incorrect.

[garstonite]

POSSIBLY Good News - but as we all know - not all trees are correct

Frederick Ernst
Born in February 1824 - Saxony, Kamenz, Sachsen, Germany
Deceased in 1901 - Paterson, Passaic Co. NJ, aged 77 years old
 
Spouses and children
With Clementine Minnie DOERFELDT 1836-1915 with
M Otto Ernst ca 1869-
 is this YOUR tree ? - Lucas Nakajima ??  just realised - possibly not - you have posted Clementine DRODFELDT - this tree has DOERFELDT ??
I AM CONFUSED NOW ...lol

[garstonite]

same tree owner - if this is the online tree you proved to be incorrect let me know and I will delete it
Clementine Minnie Dearford Doerfeldt
Born 12 August 1836 - Saxony, Kamenz, Sachsen, Germany
Deceased in 1915, aged 79 years old
 
Spouses and children
Married in 1857, Germany, to Frederick ERNST 1824-1897 with
F Jennie Ernst
M Max Ernst
F Caroline Ernst 1856-
F Annie Ernst 1859-1880/
F Thekla Martha Ernst 1861-1911/
F Clara Meta Ernst 1864-1934
F Meta Ernst ca 1866-
M Clement Ernst 1866-1940/
M Otto Egreghor ERNST 1869-1948
M Richard Ernst 1869-1962
F Rachel Ernst 1871-1905/
M Charles Frederick Ernst 1874-1947
M John Ernst ca 1877-1952
.............................................................
Events
12 August 1836 :   Birth - Saxony, Kamenz, Sachsen, Germany
1836 :   Birth
about 1836 :   Birth - Saxony
Sources: 1880 United States Federal Census - Ancestry.com and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints - 2010 - Lehi, UT, USA - 1,6742::0 - Tenth Census of the United States, 1880. (NARA microfilm publication T9, 1,454 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National Archives, Washington, D.C. - Year: 1880; Census Place: Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey; Roll: 795; Page: 29D; Enumeration District: 151 - 1,6742::36201767
--- :   Departure - Bremen, Germany
Sources: New York Port, Ship Images, 1851-1891 - 1,8644::0 - Ancestry.com - 1,8644::1376545
1857 :   Marriage (with Frederick ERNST) - Germany
1880 :   Residence - Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey, USA
Sources: 1880 United States Federal Census - Ancestry.com and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints - 2010 - Lehi, UT, USA - 1,6742::0 - Tenth Census of the United States, 1880. (NARA microfilm publication T9, 1,454 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National Archives, Washington, D.C. - Year: 1880; Census Place: Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey; Roll: 795; Page: 29D; Enumeration District: 151 - 1,6742::36201767
18 July 1885 :   Arrival - Port of New York, New York, United States
Sources: New York Port, Ship Images, 1851-1891 - 1,8644::0 - Ancestry.com - 1,8644::1376545
1915 :   Death
11 April 1915 :   Death - Patterson, Passaic, New Jersey, United States

so - is this your tree ?  coincidence the owner is also a Lucas

[LucasKernan]

same tree owner - if this is the online tree you proved to be incorrect let me know and I will delete it
Clementine Minnie Dearford Doerfeldt
Born 12 August 1836 - Saxony, Kamenz, Sachsen, Germany
Deceased in 1915, aged 79 years old
 
Spouses and children
Married in 1857, Germany, to Frederick ERNST 1824-1897 with
F Jennie Ernst
M Max Ernst
F Caroline Ernst 1856-
F Annie Ernst 1859-1880/
F Thekla Martha Ernst 1861-1911/
F Clara Meta Ernst 1864-1934
F Meta Ernst ca 1866-
M Clement Ernst 1866-1940/
M Otto Egreghor ERNST 1869-1948
M Richard Ernst 1869-1962
F Rachel Ernst 1871-1905/
M Charles Frederick Ernst 1874-1947
M John Ernst ca 1877-1952
.............................................................
Events
12 August 1836 :   Birth - Saxony, Kamenz, Sachsen, Germany
1836 :   Birth
about 1836 :   Birth - Saxony
Sources: 1880 United States Federal Census - Ancestry.com and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints - 2010 - Lehi, UT, USA - 1,6742::0 - Tenth Census of the United States, 1880. (NARA microfilm publication T9, 1,454 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National Archives, Washington, D.C. - Year: 1880; Census Place: Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey; Roll: 795; Page: 29D; Enumeration District: 151 - 1,6742::36201767
--- :   Departure - Bremen, Germany
Sources: New York Port, Ship Images, 1851-1891 - 1,8644::0 - Ancestry.com - 1,8644::1376545
1857 :   Marriage (with Frederick ERNST) - Germany
1880 :   Residence - Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey, USA
Sources: 1880 United States Federal Census - Ancestry.com and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints - 2010 - Lehi, UT, USA - 1,6742::0 - Tenth Census of the United States, 1880. (NARA microfilm publication T9, 1,454 rolls). Records of the Bureau of the Census, Record Group 29. National Archives, Washington, D.C. - Year: 1880; Census Place: Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey; Roll: 795; Page: 29D; Enumeration District: 151 - 1,6742::36201767
18 July 1885 :   Arrival - Port of New York, New York, United States
Sources: New York Port, Ship Images, 1851-1891 - 1,8644::0 - Ancestry.com - 1,8644::1376545
1915 :   Death
11 April 1915 :   Death - Patterson, Passaic, New Jersey, United States

so - is this your tree ?  coincidence the owner is also a Lucas

This is a old account. Just to make sure you were listening:

I cannot find any marriage, exact birthplace, or proof. I know that they married in 1857. There are online Family Tree which say that they were born in Kamenz but I have confirmed that it is incorrect.

I have confirmed that they weren’t born in Kamenz. There is no Proof.

[TreeSpirit]

Have you tried to throw the net a bit wider by looking at the birthplaces of the children first?

e.g.
In 1911 Clementine is on a passenger list with daughter Tekla Martha and her 2 sons: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C9T4-99ZW-L?i=118 
Tekla has Mülsen, Saxony mentioned as her place of birth.

Historically there were 3 neighbouring places with the same name:
Mülsen Sankt Micheln - https://www.meyersgaz.org/place/20229018
Mülsen Sankt Jacob - https://www.meyersgaz.org/place/20229017
Mülsen Sankt Niclas - https://www.meyersgaz.org/place/20229019

N.B. It is only 4.2 km from Mülsen Sankt Micheln, via Mülsen Sankt Jacob, to Mülsen Sankt Niclas.

[TreeSpirit]

I realised that that passenger list also tells us that "Frederick's" first name is Carl.
i.e. This is most likely his 1874-1884 immigration file (although it doesn't tell us anything more): https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89QW-B7DN?i=1202

[LucasKernan]

I realised that that passenger list also tells us that "Frederick's" first name is Carl.
i.e. This is most likely his 1874-1875 immigration file (although it doesn't tell us anything more): https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89QW-B7DN?i=1202

I wonder if there is a naturalization record of him (and Clementine)

[TreeSpirit]

I realised that that passenger list also tells us that "Frederick's" first name is Carl.
i.e. This is most likely his 1874-1875 immigration file (although it doesn't tell us anything more): https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89QW-B7DN?i=1202

I wonder if there is a naturalization record of him (and Clementine)

Sorry, the link I gave is it .....

[LucasKernan]

I have contacted the archives but didn’t get any reply. What could I do Next?