Underwritten Memorial Deed

[chrisos]

Hi
I have a copy of a Memorial Deed dated 1801 for Kilgarvan, co Kerry which has three underwriters, one of whom maybe related judging by the name.  Can anyone advise me as to why this was necessary? 
Many thanks
Chris

[Elwyn Soutter]

Not quite sure what you mean by “three underwriters.” Can you explain or attach a snippet?

Was this a 3 lives lease by any chance? In which case it would last as long as at least one of the named persons was still alive, or for the specified term, whichever was the longer.

[chrisos]

Thank you for replying.  The lease for 6.5 gneeves at Shandrum Lower was a renewal of an earlier one dated 1769, so for 31 years.  New lessors were Daniel & Morto Sullivan, possibly related to original lessors John & Desmitt Downy (aka Sullivan).  Daniel & Morto were from Coomhola, Bantry. Appears to have been underwritten (Uwrtn on deed) by Timothy Sullivan and Martin Buckley of Ardtully and a man named Murphy from Kilpadder.  I wondered if Daniel & Morto were under 21 therefore requiring an underwriter.
Chris

[Elwyn Soutter]

Not sure I am any the wiser. Can you give me the Registry of Deeds reference number so I can look it up? (I can see at least 3 Sullivan deeds relating to Shandrum in the Land Indexes for Kerry around that period. Not sure which is the right one.)

[chrisos]

Hi Elwyn
I live in NSW, Aust so apologise for delay in replying to your latest comment.  Have attached a copy of the Mem Deed in question.

To fill you in on my Sullivan research which will put my interest in this Mem Deed into perspective:

1769 - Richard Orpen leases land to Daniel & Desmatt Downy (aka Sullivan) at Lower Shandrum, Kilgarvan.  Note Orpen is a major land holder based at Ardtully, Kilgarvan.
1789 - John Sullivan of London leases land at Courenowkil, Kilgarvan to Orpen.
1798 - Probated Will of John Sullivan of London mentions brothers Timothy, Daniel & Denis Sullivan as well as sisters Catherine Ferris, Eleanor Atkins & Ann Sullivan.
1800 - the 1769 Deed registered to Daniel & Morto Sullivan of Coomhola, Bantry (a valley 6 kms west of Bantry in par. Kilmocomoge).  Timothy Sullivan & Martin Buckley of Ardtully & John Murphy of Kilpadder (also Kilgarvan) are underwriters for deed.
1826 - Patrick Thady Sullivan lease holder at Ardtully.  No Sullivans at Shandrum.  However there is a John & Daniel Connor (is this a Sullivan nickname??)
1830 - Jeremiah Sullivan bpt to Daniel Sullivan & Catherine Lynch at Regurane which was a subtownland of Ardtully.  Also known as Ummeireigurane.  Additional children born Adrtully  Murtagh (Morto)1833 & Mary 1836.  Jeremiah is my line of interest.

DNA evidence also confirms links to both Ardtully & Cousane, par. Kilmocomoge, Bantry.

So .. I am trying to establish if there is a definite connection between the Sullivans above, particularly Timothy (1800) to Daniel & Morto (1800), as this would possibly link them to the John Sullivan in London.   I also feel strongly that the Daniel & Morto Sullivan from Coomhola would explain the DNA link to Cousane.

Elwyn, I would also be very interested in the Land Indexes for the Sullivan at Shandrum & Ardtully.  Are they freely available in the public domain?
Many thanks for your help
Chris

[Elwyn Soutter]

The underwriters were simply the witnesses to the agreement. I don’t think there was any legal requirement to have 3, 2 was usually sufficient but presumably in this case they all wanted to witness it.  Their function was simply to confirm they saw the relevant person sign the document.

I don’t think any of the parties was under 21. If that were the case, there would need to be a trust set up, and trustees appointed. There would be a reference to that. Where appropriate it would mention the Court of Chancery (if it was a court approved trust). Those signing it would then be described as trustee for X – a minor.

The Lands Index is available free on Familysearch. You need to search the indexes first to get the memorial reference numbers. Then you look the actual memorials up with those references (which can sometimes be hard to make out). It can be a bit fiddly.  There are about 20 pages of townlands beginning with the letter S in Co. Kerry for the years I looked at (up to 1809 I think). I saw 3 Sullivan leases in Shandrum in the first couple of pages. I didn't go any further but you might expect to find a few more.

[chrisos]

Hi Elwyn
Thank you very much for answering my question.  And yes, with your help I have been able to navigate my way through the Lands Index.  Many thanks for helping me with this.
Chris