Two marriages - which one?

[jimbo50]

I don't know how this archive is represented on the usual FH sites, but I have found it useful for my tracing. there's a lot to look through mind.


https://www.wiltshirerecordsociety.org.uk/digital-archive

[iwccc]

Hello mckha489, Sorry for the delay in responding.  I have not been well and my head is quite fuzzy!.  I have information of Samuel Rudman b. 1790 and d. 1841 from England Wales NonConformist Registers, also married in Pallots Marriage Index. He married Ann Tringham (1800=1879) and record is in England Select Marriages. they married on 12 Dec. 1819.   This is also in London England C. of E marriages, Banns (Parish Register).  Samuel is also in Geneanet Community Tree Index as being born 16 March, 1790 and dying 19 June 1841.
His son: Henry Rudman (1822-1885 (married Elizabeth Buckley) is in Spmmerset E England C/ of E/ Baptisms (this record shows the baptism of William Rodman)

The known history is Dudley Edgar Rudman (1909-1979) m. Aletta Roux (from living memory)
His father: Allen J. reedman (1879-1939 m. Levena J. McMaster (from living memory)
James H. Rudman 1848-1902 m. Mary Elizabeth Thomson (in geneaqnt and Ancestry Family Trees)
His father was Henry Rudman (1822-1804 m. Elizabeth M.Buckley 

[mckha489]

For information - and to get things in order in my head, and because I suspect you do not  have the original images. I have linked to them.   (You have to create an account on Familysearch, but there are no fees)  There is quite a lot of other information to be gleaned.

This is the sequence I see from James Henry RUDMAN

James Henry RUDMAN m Mary Elizabeth THOMSON
James RUDMAN m Mary BUCKLEY
Samuel RUDMAN m Ann TRINGHAM
John RUDMAN m Elizabeth ELLEN
Jeremiah RUDMAN m Mary GIBSON
Nicholas RUDMAN m Sarah HELPS


All events South Africa

James Henry RUDMAN  m Mary Elizabeth THOMPSON 8 December 1875   
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tf9/
his death registration in 1902 confirms birth about 1847, Cape Colony. Parents James RUDMAN and Mary BUCKLEY   Informant is a son.
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tf7/

__________________________________

James RUDMAN & Mary BUCKLEY married 1847   (not Henry & not Elizabeth)
a witness who makes her mark is Martha RUDMAN
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tfa/
James  death reg (1884)  names his parents as Samuel & Ann RUDMAN
He is 62 years old so born about 1822 Cape Colony. 
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tf8/

_________________________________

Samuel RUDMAN & Ann TRINGHAM

I cannot see Samuel’s death supposedly 1July 1841 - but no-one has a source for that.
A child - Rachel Eliza was born & baptised 1840

Now we are in England

Marriage St Andrew, Holborn, City of London
Samuel RUDMAN & Ann TRINGHAM married 12 December 1819. image on Ancestry
both signed
a witness was Benjamin RUDMAN.  Brother?  Also went to South Africa?
_____________________________________

England & Wales Non-Conformist and Non-Parochial registers - Ancestry

“ The children of John Rudman. Himself was born Jan 27th 1765
whose wife was Elizabeth the Daughter of Thos Ellen
(his wife is a member)

James Rudman was born the 19th of Sept 1788
Samuel 16th Mar 1790
Rachel 10th July 1791
William 24th Dec 1792 died in infancy
Benjamin 9th Apr 1794
Hannah 24th July 1796
Jonah 15th May 1798
Martha 4th Aug 1800
Mara 9th May 1802

__________________________________

John RUDMAN of this parish (St Mary the Virgin, Devizes) married Elizabeth ELLEN  of the Chapelry of St James Bishop Cannings. 3rd Banns 7th October 1787

Baptism 2 February 1765 at Rowde, Wiltshire
John RUDMAN, son of Jeremiah RUDMAN and Mary

would fit with non-parochial details above
______________________________________
a marriage
Jeremiah RUDMAN (of this parish)  and Mary GIBSON (sojourner) married by banns 7th July 1758.  a witness is M(?) RUDMAN

a baptism
28 Feb 1734, (birth 23 Feb 1734) Rowde, Wiltshire, Jeremiah. Parents Nicholas RUDMAN & Sarah


So if that is the correct path back

perhaps this marriage

Nicholas RUDMAN & Sarah HELPS 20th June 1725 at Rowde.

[mckha489]

Continued.

But needs work as it seems there are several Nicholas Rudman in every generation.
And I haven’t checked to see when they each died..so as to see if the line is feasible. These events all on Ancestry, and all have images.

Working back from this marriage

Nicholas RUDMAN & Sarah HELPS 20th June 1725 at Rowde

There is a Nicholas Rudman baptised at Rowde. Born 15, baptised 17 Jan 1706
Son of Nicholas & Ann

Nicholas & Ann PHILLIS married 26 March 1706 Rowde.
(There might be a calendar thing going on here).

Baptism.
Nicholas son of another Nicholas & Ann    28 Mar 1685. Rowde.

That couple could be Nicholas Rudman & Anne SAW who married Rowde  6 Nov 1676


Potential baptism
Nicholas,  Son of Nicholas & Jane 24 Jan 1645 (old calendar so is after the marriage below)

30 Aug 1645 marriage of Nicholas Rudman & Jane HULBERT

I am not having much luck finding a baptism for this Nicholas

[iwccc]

Thanks Jimbo50,  You are right there is a lot to go through. I am gradually working my way through I appreciate your help with this

[iwccc]

Hello mckha489.  Thank you for all your help.  Your contribution to my questions has been most helpful. I have checked with Family Search South Africa as well as Ancestry documents and have found some more answers.  I may try next to take the history back further although I suspect that information may be much more scarce.  Once again  a big thank you

[Drayke]

There are many Redman's shown as living in Broughton Gifford in many records dating before 1650.

Of note is the will of Margaret Rudman of Broughton Gifford dated 25 Nov 1629 whereby she leaves legacies in particular to her three sons William Rudman, Nicholas Rudman and Thomas Rudman. She also mentions her grandchildren Nicholas, John, Joseph and Henry Rudman.

Earlier wills from the same parish for the surname Rudman/Redman also show relatives with the names Thomas and Nicholas.

According the BT's of that parish a Nicholas Redmon son of Thomas was buried in 1623, Joseph Redmon (probably the one mentioned in the above will) was the son of John Redmon bapt. 1625, Henry son of John Redman bapt. 1627 and bur. 1628 with John having another son Henry in 1628.

May be worthwhile looking into this parish and their records to see if anything can be linked.

[iwccc]

Dear Drake, Thank you so very much for the post.  Such a lot of interesting information.  I have just  had cataract surgery so as soon as my eyes are OK I will study the information and try some of the suggestions you have made.   Very thankful for your input.  At the moment I am working backwards through the family tree and trying to find sources to confirm the information.  I am back to about 1734 at the moment. The 1500s look somewhat problematic - especially trying to read some of the old manuscripts.   Thanks again

[iwccc]

thanks teragram 31510, I obviously need to do more work on this. Thanks for your observation.  I have just had some eye surgery so I will work on it again when my eyesight improves. thanks again