Esther DAY born circa 1802 Padstow

[deb usa]

oh my 

How fab That Hannah Scott nee Cuming had a famous son ... did not realise that when I posted the 1881 census where Esther Day and hubby are living with them   

So somehow we have to link up Hammond with Cuming/Scott Familes 

I do so love a mystery....I'm on board...so to speak LOL

deb

[deb usa]

hiya everyone 

1901 census:

80 Queen Rd, Chelsea, London

Hannah scott head wid 60 b Plymouth
ROBERT F son S 32 Commander Royal Navy b devon Stoke Damerel
Grace M dau s 30 b Stoke Damerel
and 2 servants...

deb

PS   through all of this searching ...I have not seen an Irish link ... or maybe I missed something as I was not looking for it ....

[krisesjoint]

Hi debco,

Glad you have joined us. Sorry coonwarra isn't actually connected to you as yet. 

Sounds fascinating trying to figure out these Kunze's. Your Photo is clearer than the one I found. I could not read the Altona Denmark on there, sounds like you have learned more about the place and the connection to Hamburg, so that is good news. 

Pity you already had all the records I had found so far. I had hoped I may have found some you didn't have. Let me know if you are missing any and I will go through the fiche for you. 

Children missing in census etc I am guessing they may have travelled with their father. I didn't find Henry till he was married and had to find the baptism to be sure he was one of Peter's. I suspected he was by his occupation but he had not appeared in a census with his family. I see Henry Arthur's baptism lists a birth date but not that he was born at sea. Going through microfiche is very time consuming and I haven't looked for what became of John Day and George. Do you have them?

An explorer, how fascinating.  Would you believe I grew up on stories of another famous explorer and aviator Sir Hubert Wilkins my Grandma's Cousin.......  Lies all lies. First I thought he must have been her second cousin when I proved they were not first cousins, but no. Not even from the same counties. Dad knew so much about Sir Hubert, had books on him, told stories about him all the time. He died still believing the stories.

I have just found the other threads where coonwarra has been trying to connect up this explorer, so will add them here so we are not duplicating. Will be interesting to see if this does connect

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,237486.msg1286429.html#msg1286429

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,238041.0.html

Cheers Kris 

[andrew shanks]

The 1841 census for Outlands has some as yet unidentified Scotts:

Rosa Scott aged 45 not born in county (don't know who she is)
Anne Scott aged 40 (presumably Anne Myers wife of Robert)
Charlotte Scott aged 20 (don't know who she is)
Emma Scott aged 20 (presumably daughter of Robert & Anne)
Rosa Scott aged 12 (presumably daughter of Rosa aged 45?)
Edwin Scott aged 15 (don't know who he is)
John Scott aged 10 (presumably son of Robert & Anne)
plus various servant

 

[deb usa]

Okay guys

I am trying to wrap my head around this .... How would Mary elizabeth Hammond be related? She was born 1868 Dublin ....
so ... to be a cousin of Robert Falcon Scott ...she would have to be related to Hannah Scott nee Cumings' siblings, or John E Scott's siblings.... ummm I get so confused sometime ....

help me out here...LOL ....

who did Mary Elizabeth Hammond marry?

gosh ...I think I need a glass of wine 

deb

[andrew shanks]

Mary Elizabeth Hammond married Thomas Hannah on 3 Jul 1895 in Dublin.  He was from Stirlingshire in Scotland and they moved there after their marriage.

Her parents were Thomas Hammond and Agnes Templeton.  This is where the trail goes cold.  I have been unable to find the marriage of Thomas Hammond and Agnes Templeton.  Also, most of the census docs for Dublin no longer exist, so I don't know when or where either of them were born.

Mary Elizabeth Hammond died young during the 1918 flu pandemic.  My reason for looking for a connection to Scott is because she gave each of her 3 children (including my grandmother) a gold American dollar.  My grandmother passed her's on to me and told me that her mother had been given these coins by Capt. Scott's mother and that they were related.

Obviously old family stories can often become muddled or exagerrated but I think it is an interesting tale worth investigating.  As Scott's wife came from a long line of Irish ancestors I guess it is possible that any connection may actually be through her but I need to check out Scott's ancestry first before going into hers in any great detail.

Time to wrap a warm towel around the head and lie down in a darkened room!

 

[deb usa]

Hi

If your gr Grandmother, Mary Elizabeth Hannah (b 1868), received  gold coins from Hannah Scott nee Cuming (b 1841) , then they would have had to have met up sometime or other in order for Hannah to give Mary E the coin.

In the 1901 census there are a few Mary E Hannah's born Ireland liviing in London.... I wonder if your Mary E Hannah came to London (as this is where Hannah Scott was living in 1901 with Robert F Scott), before going to Scotland to live..??

Can you give us the details of Mary E and Thomas Hannah's children.....

deb


PS: I remember doing a project in school (a long time ago  ) on Robert Scott and his Antarctic expedition .... in those days we had to use the library books etc ... how much easier would it have been to have had the internet 

[deb usa]

Hi again

I have been looking in the BRUCE family.... In all sources (except BMD) regarding Robert F Scott's marriage they say he married Kathleen Bruce. Coonwarra has said that he married EDITH ...

in the 1881 census;
Lloyd S Bruce,( b 1830, Ireland) Canon of York, rector of Carlton is a widower living with his children ....
Wilfred M (6)
Helen J T  (4)
Edith A K (3)
I can find no Kathleen ...

Okay ... here is a Birth:
Edith AGNES K Bruce
June Q 1878
Notts, Worksop
Maybe her full name was Edith Agnes K(athleen) Bruce and she went by Kathleen!

Lloyd S Bruce's wife was Jane ..she was born (it looks like) Greece (British Subject) sooo it looks like the Irish side is with Lloyd S BRUCE!

I have google Lloyd S Bruce, Canon of York to find his parentage ...but no luck!

Lloyd S Bruce died Mar Q 1886, Christchurch Hampshire.
Lloyd married JANE SKENE in Dec Q 1863, Oxford Berkshire
all their children were born in England(Yorkshire and Notts).
I cannot find Lloyd in the 1861 census ...maybe he was still in Ireland!

ummmm How can we get Lloyds parents names ...maybe i should research the marriages of all Edith A K Bruce's siblings ( there are many in 1871 census) and see if we can find a marriage to either a Hammond, Templeton or Hannah....

I need coffeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee and Chocolate to keep me going   

Deb

[andrew shanks]

Hi Deb USA (and others)

Your theory of Elizabeth Hammond and her husband Thomas Hannah visiting the Scott's in London is an interesting theory and I guess it is entirely possible.  However, I have them in Stirlingshire, Scotland in the 1901 census:

29 Wallace Street, Grangemouth
Thomas Hannah, Head M 33, Railway Clerk, Stirlingshire, Bothkennar
Elizabeth Hannah, Wife M 31, Ireland
Georgina Hannah, Daughter 1

They had 2 further children - Annie McInnes Hannah born June 1901 and Thomas Hammond Hannah born April 1910.  All 3 children were born in Stirlingshire. 

We know that the Hammond's had lived in Dublin since at least 1868 as Mary Elizabeth Hammond was born there.  Mary's sister was in the main Post Office there when the IRA took it over in the Easter rising of 1916.  As Protestants they were unable to stay in Dublin and moved to Bangor.  From there I believe that a few of them moved to England, although unfortunately I have no names etc.

As far as Capt Scott's wife is concerned I have her as Edith Agnes Kathleen Bruce, daughter of Lloyd Stewart Bruce and Jane Skene.  I think that the 1878 birth that you found is most likely her.

I found 2 possible births for her father in the IGI:

Lloyd Stewart Bruce - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1840 Downhill, Londonderry, Ireland

Lloyd Stewart Bruce - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1837 Of, Inverurie, Aberdeen, Scotland

I think the Londonderry one is most likely.  If so, then he was the son of James Robertson Bruce, born 04 Sep 1788 at Downhill, Londonderry - I have not yet identified the mother.  This Bruce line can be traced right back to the family of Robert The Bruce King Of Scots and all the way back to the Kings of Upsalla in Sweden - a very impressive lineage indeed!!!!!! 

If there is a link to my family then I imagine that it must be via one of the much poorer relations!

I don't know anything about Jane Skene other than her marriage to  Lloyd Stewart Bruce.  I wonder why her mother was in Greece at the time of her birth?  It's all getting very interesting.