Harriet Maria Ram/Rann I.O.W.

[Piperatthegates]

Hi,

I have come to a brick wall with a Harriet Maria Ram (or possibly Rann). She married one of my ancestors (James Moore Piper) on 20/12/1864 (both ages given as Full) in Westminster, Father listed as Edward Ram, Labourer.

On the 1871 Census as Harriet Piper (age 30) her birthplace is Ryde, Isle of Wight, from there on it is just I.O.W. in the 1881 and 1891.

I have not been able to find any trace of her prior to the marriage. Are there any I.O.W. genealogists out there familiar with the family? There appear to be a few Ram/Rann families on the island but I cannot find Harriet.

I would really like to know her birthplace as I visit the island every few years, so in due course I would love to visit and see where she was born.

Happy Hunting everyone 

[Necromancer]

presumably you've seen this ?


Order the Cert and it will show an address and of course parents ....

Births Dec 1840   Rann  Harriet    I. of Wight  Vol 8 Page 228

[Little Nell]

Interestingly there is no Harriet Rann or Ram listed on the Isle of Wight BMD Index.

BUT, there is a Harriet Payne registered in 1840 in the Ryde district of the island, mother's maiden name Rann...................

There are some other births in the index where the name is Rann, but the mother's maiden surname is Payne (an Edward! and a George to name two)

Marriage in 1843:

Edward Rann married Mary Payne at St George, Arreton.

The family appears on the 1851 census in Arreton, but no Harriet, Rann or Payne.

Mary died in 1857 aged 36 and Edward remarried in 1859 to Hannah Kingswell.

Maybe?

Nell

[Necromancer]

You dont rate the GRO entry then Nell ?

[Piperatthegates]

Hi,

Thank you both so much, It is amazing how a brick wall can stump for ages and then a post here and the wall crumbles 

How did you find the Birth details Newfster? I thought I had looked everywhere,  by the sound of it, the Harriet Rann may well be the Harriet Payne that Nell also found, as they are both 1840

I am not too sure as to what you mean Nell by "The family appears on the 1851 census in Arreton, but no Harriet, Rann or Payne" but I will now look at the census and it will then probably make more sense.

I will send off for the Cert that Newfster has found whilst looking into the leads that Nell has also found, to cover all bases.

A Big Big Thank You to you both 

[Necromancer]

Hi Pipester - thats from FreeBMD  ( http://freebmd.rootsweb.com )

Nells source is a local transcription of the Birth Index from IOW Registry Office(s) -- http://www.isle-of-wight-fhs.co.uk/  its strange that it doesnt have the one I found in the GRO Index ...... the local ofice would have submitted their records to the GRO, so the original should be there for the IOW FHS transcription ...


I found a family of Ranns in 1851 father George, mother Harriette - with an 1840/1 daughter transcribed 'Janes' - but the image wasnt clear  ... however no JANE was registered at all .....


keep us posted with the content of the Birth Cert ....

 

Added - section from a search for 'RANN' in the above site produces:-

Name-  -Approximate Date of birth- -Other Surname(s)- -District Reference

1 GRAY, George  1840  RANN  Godshill G2/P6
2 RANN, Jane  1840  BLOW  Newport N2/P94
3 PAYNE, Harriet  1840  RANN  Ryde R3/P8

So Jane Rann is there in the Local Register, but not in the GRO - I wonder if a correction was made after a quarterly submission ?

[Piperatthegates]

Hi all

  I was certain I had looked on BMD  I must be getting old and "fused"

It sounds to me that the two (Harriet Rann and Harriet Payne) are one and the same and the married and maiden names somehow have got transposed, especially as possibly she was born before her parents got married, from what Nell has found that seems to be the case, so perhaps the couple wanted both names on the register in some form?

I have sent off for the Cert and I will eagerly await further developments, and keep you posted.

Martin AKA Piper

[Piperatthegates]

Hi Again 

Thinking about it, on the I.O.W. FHS website, for ordering the cert, Rann is down as Maiden name (or other surname...) my guess is that the birth was registered by Mary Payne and Edward Rann, and Harriet was entered as Harriet Payne, but when the returns went to the mainland someone took a look and decided that as the father was named, then the child i.e. Harriet should be registered under the fathers name, hence the discrepancy between the island records and the mainland records.

Does this make sense or am I thinking too much

All the Best
and will keep you posted.

[Daisypetal]

Hi,

Possibly Harriet in 1841,


1841  HO107/406/6  f.8  p.11  Newchurch, Isle of Wight
Newchurch Rd
//
John GROVES    56   Labourer
Sarah    "  "      56
Mary PAYNE      25    Labour
Thomas  "  "      61      "  "
Harriet    "  "       1                      All born in County
//   


and just to confuse things further

the IGI has,

Harriett Maria PAYNE
Christening:  29 NOV 1840   Newchurch, Hampshire
Father:  John PAYNE
Mother:  Mary     
 
 
Regards
Daisy