Right of Burial

[Erincyprus]

They do that Dave in Ireland when they reach Ten..lol


Erin

[davierj]

In Spain they 'bury' people in niches in a wall just like a honeycomb.   The hole is then bricked up and memorial tablets can be attached to the front.   The richer folk have rather grand mausoleums.   What happens in Cyprus?

Dave

[teresaevans]

It is my understanding that up until the Local Authorities Cemeteries Order 1977 came into force which grants burial for up to 100 years, that grants issued before this time were perpetual rights...meaning forever.

Hope this helps

teresaevans

[davierj]

That was my feeling too, but I wasn't aware when the regs changed.   As I mentioned earlier , it would appear that currently in Ceredigion the Right lasts 100 years but with an option of a longer period if there is proof of relationship.   If this is the case, then theoretically the Right is in perpetuity, subject to the proviso of sufficient room.

Dave

[teresaevans]

Hi Dave

You mention that it appears to be currently the case that in Ceredigion that rights last 100 years. I am not aware of any local authority in England that grants the max that the law allows for. It is usually 99 years and many in England have moved to only granting in some instances 30 years...even on triple depth graves.

My father had been granted 99 years for the double depth grave that he bought when my mother passed away. My father was later buried in the same grave and the rights passed to me. I later lost my son and I bought the exclusive rights for a single depth grave. I took it for granted that the rights was the same and never read the document when it arrived. I only learnt last year that 30 years had been granted. I never imagined that I would need to address in my own lifetime renewing the grant on my son's grave.  I think that this is appalling which made me begin examining what other local authorities grant under the law.

I learnt that remaining space in consecrated graves are being reused in the City of London cemetery and being resold as Heritage graves. The City of London has applied for a faculty to move to the lift and deepen method. For any readers that do not know what this practice is, it is where the body is removed, the grave dug deeper and the body replaced...freeing up space to sell more graves. I am not aware that this method has been adopted yet, but it will for certain and one can be sure that when it does happen that this practice will be adopted by local authorities across England and Wales.

In respect of of your understanding of extending burial rights for a longer period if there is proof of relationship, this is not my understanding. I do not believe that relationship has anything to do with rights granted, but you would need to read the Local Authorities Cemeteries Order yourself or maybe another member of the forum will provide the answer. If this fails to be the case I would have a chat with an officer at your local authority.

teresaevans

[davierj]

The Ceredigion County Council website states that Right of Burial (R of B) may be granted for up to 100 years intimating that the R of B may be for any period up to that max.   They further state that there are possibilities that an extension may be granted at the end of that period.   I guess each different council treats each case separately and can grant what it wishes according to prevailing local conditions.   See..........

http://www.ceredigion.gov.uk/index.cfm.articleid=15756 select FAQs, question nos. 8 & 11

What is a Heritage Grave?   Never heard that one before.   It must be a smart way to make even more money.

In Spain it's a case of cremation or burial in a hole in a wall (niche) like a honeycomb, unless you are super rich and can afford a mausoleum.   It costs roughly 500 euro to purchase a niche for a fixed period normally up to 50 years and there may or may not be rental fees also.

Dave

[davierj]

If the link above does not work go to.....

http://www.ceredigion.gov.uk/

Select English or Welsh, go to Community and Living, then select  Cemeteries, then finally FAQs.   I tried the above link and is a bit odd.

Dave

[teresaevans]

Hi Dave

I believe that you misinterpret what is stated in the FAQ in the link that you provide. What is stated is that the local authority does issue times granted in graves for up to 100 years, but this does not mean that this is in actual fact the time that the authority grants. If you want to be certain I would give them a call to find out. Your district could be one of the lucky ones that has not changed its practice.

I campaign for the rights of newly bereaved people to be made obvious to them in the immediate hours and days following a death. It is my experience that many burial authorities do not look to educate people about changes occurring across the country about times granted in graves. I recently flagged this up in a newspaper published locally. Instead the authority relies on people establishing this for themselves in the immediate hours following a death, and likely leaving many people quite shocked to learn that the time is no longer for ever and far removed from 100 years. 

Claims for reducing times granted in graves or reusing them is because of the shortage of grave space. I wonder how many people might choose cremation over burial if they were to determine that they were making decisions on traditional practice or assumption that they or their relatives will remain undisturbed forever. Given statistics indicate that 70% of funerals are now cremations, I wonder if there is an agenda and authorities claim that grave space is in short supply just to reduce times granted so that they can generate more income in a shorter period of time!

Best wishes

Teresa

[davierj]

Hi Teresa,

I don't think I misinterpreted anything, the pivotal word in my post was 'may' which implied that the time granted is at the discretion of each particular council taking into account conditions peculiar to that area.   For example in west Wiltshire the time granted for a cremation plot in a municipal cemetery was 45 years (10 years ago).   The answer to the question on the Ceredigion site is a generalisation and each individual case would be looked at as and when the time arose.   I agree with you that it would be far better for a generally recognised policy throughout the whole country so that bereaved people would be spared the sudden shock of learning that things were not as expected.

In Aberystwyth Muicipal Cemetery, which is where the 1887 Grant was taken out, they are no longer taking new burials, only in existing graves.   The site of the new cemetery is a couple of miles out of town so presumably there is now more space.   Will not directly concern me as I'm not going there unless I'm shoe-horned into an existing grave.

Cheers Dave