robert gates of london

[pwh]

I am seeking  information on  Robert Gates. This what I know about him. He was born in  St
Marylebone  London in 1815. The census of 1841 and 1861 show him living un  St Pancras.
The 1871 census has him in St James Clerkenwell  . He died in London  in  1875  He  was
a cordwainer, a maker of  quality shoes.  He was married to Bridget Boilin, born in Ireland.
They had two daughters  Ann Norah and  Margaret.  They came to Australia on the  Royal
Dane in 1865.  Ann Norah was my great grand mother.  I know nothing about his  background.
Can anyone  help?
                                                   Thanks
                                                               pwh

[karenlee]

Hi

Not sure if you already have this, but his marriage certificate gives some interesting information...


Marriage Register
St Marylebone
Westminster

1st Jult 1839

Robert Gates PERRY of full age Bachelor Cordwainer of 15 Tonbridge Street Father= George GATES Labourer

Bridget BOLIN a Minor Spinster of 19 Suffolk Street Father = Patrick BOLIN Labourer

The bride and groom both made their marks

Witnesses William Gates PERRY and Mary KINE both made their marks.


Cheers
Karenlee

[pwh]

Karenlee,
                     No I did not have that.  This the first time  I have had  any  information  on  his
                    family. But why did he give his family name as Perry ?  Another  mystery to try
                    to solve. Thanks very  much.

                                                                                 pwh

[karenlee]

Just so that all the information is here on the thread....


1861 Census England Middlesex St Pancras Camden Town
RG9/118/70/41
8 Thornley Place

GATES
Robert Head Marr 44 Shoe Maker Middlesex St Giles
Bridget Wife Marr 38 Ireland
Clara Dau Unmarr 19 Middlesex St Marylebone
Frances Dau Unmarr 17 Shoe Maker Middlesex Marylebone
Anne Dau Unmarr 13 Shoe Maker Middlesex Pancras
Christopher Son Unmarr 11 Scholar Middlesex Pancras
Mary Dau Unmarr 4 Scholar Middlesex Pancras
Robert Son Unmarr 3mths  Middlesex Pancras


Karenlee

[majm]

Hi there Peter,

On one of your Australian threads you noted that you have Ann Norah HART’s death cert (death registered in Queensland Aust in 1936)  giving you her parents as Robert GATES and Bridget BOLIN.   You also note that it confrms her first marriage (Edward GREEN, 1868 Rockhampton Qld Aust) and her second marriage,  also in Rockhampton to Henry HART the following year.    I understand from another RChatter who has a copy of that death certificate that the informant was Ann’s grandson, as Mr Hart had died some 29 years before.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=519984.0 

Can you please confirm the details that the bride provided about her parents on the two queensland marriage certificates 

I see the marriages as
1870, Henry HART and Ann GATES   (#c434)
1868 Edward GREEN and Ann Norah GATES (#c484)

Pwh has the 1868 mc as per his Edward GREEN thread.   
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=518883.0

The information on Queensland marriage certs is usually quite detailed.  It ought to include the names (including nee and other former names) for all four parents (of the bride and groom)  and the status of the bride and the groom (bachelor/spinster; widow/er, divorcee/petitioner or respondent) and the ages of the bride and groom and their places of birth, occupations, then usual addresses etc.    (Divorce came to Queensland in 1864).

There are quite a number of threads re the OP’s HART family, and I have previously contributed to several of those threads.   I would expect the information provided on the marriage certificates to be a tad more reliable (given first hand by the parties) than information given by a grandson on Ann HART’s death cert.

Cheers,  JM

[karenlee]

Not sure why Bridget has become Ann here... but pretty sure this is the same family as the 1861 Census in previous post...

1851 Census England Middlesex St Pancras Camden Town
HO107/1497/573/19
1 Smith Place

GATES
Robert Head Marr 35 Boot and Shoe Maker Middlesex St Pancras
Ann?? Wife Marr 27 Boot and Shoe Binder St Pancras??
??( think it should be Clara ) Dau Unmarr 10 Middlesex St Pancras
Francis Son ? Unmarr 8 Middlesex St Pancras
Margaret Dau Unmarr 6 Middlesex St Pancras
Ann Dau Unmarr 4 Middlesex St Pancras
Christopher Son Unmarr 1 Middlesex St Pancras

Karenlee

[karenlee]

Afternoon JM...  wise words as always....

(BTW how's it going ?  )

[majm]

afternoon karenlee,

There's also some public trees at Ancestry, with Robert GATES as father, and NO mention of PERRY at all ....  I am not sure if these have been verified (or even partly checked).   

As you can see, I am still pedantic re checking information against official records, and getting to the primary records where there's info provided first hand, rather than second or third hand.   I doubt I will ever change.   Fifty years or more of seeking out the primary sources, it is basically second nature to me.   

Cheers,  JM