Marriage licence, Llanfrynach, 1834 - Thomas DAVIES to Mary DAVIES

[MarMnkly]

Deirdre
have you seen this on page 728 (not sure which Thomas it is) from 1903
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/Edinburgh/issue/11530/page/728/data.pdf

[Deirdre784]

Deirdre
have you seen this on page 728 (not sure which Thomas it is) from 1903
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/Edinburgh/issue/11530/page/728/data.pdf

Hi Mar, yes about an hour ago! Got home from work, quick dinner, then on the computer

It was the one born in 1837 (my husband's ggg grandfather). We knew he was in Cilfynydd by 1911 (a widower lodging with his son's father in law ). This is great as it shows he was there in 1903, at the house where his son David Thomas Davies and his wife were living in 1901. Neither Thomas nor his wife Gwenllian are buried in Llanfrynach so I'm hoping Gwenllian's death will be in Pontypridd, and then find Thomas's too (there are a couple!).

By 1911 David and his wife had a large family (8 children) so I guess it was easier for Thomas to lodge elsewhere (though they then had 8 people in their house, inc 2 young children). But he's not with them by the 1915 electoral register which may narrow down his death.

The Thomas who was at the pub in 1851, 1861 and 1871 died in 1886 (he was a farmer of 101 acres at Trallong in 1881). His son William was at the pub in 1881 and probably still in 1891 (pub not listed in the census), before he died in 1893, aged 45. The 1837 Thomas was back in Llanfrynach (as a blacksmith) by 1891 and presumably took over after William's death until sometime soon after 1901.

Have looked at the links you sent last night, thanks. That listing of Thomas as landlord in 1820 is fascinating, though I'm no nearer finding out if he is Thomas b1837's father or grandfather. I'll have to see if Powys archives will look for the licence, though I guess that may not say anything about his age. I have to admit that I'm thinking it's his father - despite his age - though nothing concrete to prove it.

Fascinating hobby this family history, though it can take over a bit!

Thanks again for all your help, much appreciated. As you say, strange not to find any obits or more stories given the long family links with the area.

Deirdre

[MarMnkly]

Deirdre
if you go back to the FindMyPast marriage images, they start in 1813 (marriage of David Evans) in the presence of Thos Davies (clerk). The clerk continues to witness marriages on every page of the register, and (if they are one and the same person) on the same page as the wedding of Thomas Davies (innkeeper) to Mary Davies. The last time I can see him signing against a marriage is 1839 (marriage of Priscilla Roberts).
In terms of the question, "Is Thomas, innkeeper and Thomas, clerk/parish clerk the same person?" have a look at the handwriting in the wedding signature of Thomas and those of the parish clerk. I think they may the same (albeit Thomas not Thos on own wedding), but you would sign your full name on your marriage certificate.
Margaret

[Deirdre784]

Margaret, that would be amazing, I'm going to have a look now I wonder if that was why he needed a licence to marry

I emailed Powys archives about the licence last night, and Powys registrars re the 1837 Thomas Davies birth (I'd found a birth in the Sep 1837 quarter which looked good for his 1 Oct baptism. Amazingly it's his birth, in the inn. Must be one of the earliest births registered. Copy on order. 

Back later, Deirdre

Edited to add: I have to agree Margaret, many of the Davies 'clerk' signatures as well as his own marriage signature have a very distinctive loop at the top of the 'D' - that is really exciting, and makes me think that he was the Thomas Davies at the inn in 1841 and our Thomas's father, not grandfather. I'm off to have a look and see what the clerk's role was.....   

[Deirdre784]

It seems parish clerks usually had a day job as well, they were generally appointed for life and were responsible for administrative matters within the church. It will be interesting to see what his occupation is given as on Thomas' birth certificate

All makes sense and probably explains his role in the friendly society too.

Learning a lot today

[MarMnkly]

There is an old post on Rootschat about the desired characteristics of a parish clerk
 http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,243105
Would give a clue to his family history in terms of being able to read/write.

Still think there must be more about his death somewhere, although doesn't seem to be anything in the old newspapers?
Have you been to the grave yard at all to see if there is a headstone?

[Deirdre784]

Thanks Margaret,

If we go to the archives we can have a look at the old newspapers kept there, maybe they are just not online yet; you would certainly imagine there'd be something on him if he was clerk for all those years, and a long standing resident of the village.

Have you been to the grave yard at all to see if there is a headstone?

Not yet; I'd never even heard of Llanfrynach until a few weeks ago 

Deirdre

[Deirdre784]

Powys archives don't seem to have any newspapers from the time of Thomas' death; they all start much later, the Brecon Journal from 1855 being the earliest.

[MarMnkly]

I cant see anything in Welsh Newspapers Online in that specific year of his death http://newspapers.library.wales/
It seems Thomas was also dealing in coal with business partners - quite the entrepreneur 
https://discover.llgc.org.uk/default.ashx?q=%22thomas+Davies%22