Author Topic: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886  (Read 2573 times)

Offline jnomad

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John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« on: Tuesday 31 August 21 22:46 BST (UK) »
I would like to find out about the family he came from. I imagine he was a younger son of a farmer, and because the family farm wasn't for him he made his living in the town (at one point as a sewed muslin agent, later as a commission agent). But which family and where? There seem to have been McDowells all around Antrim. I hoped finding the in-laws of Jane McDowell, who died in Antrim in 1871, would be an indirect way to get at his family; I hoped she would turn out to be his sister-in-law. But a very informative thread about her (thanks again, gaffy) has I think ruled that out. So what about him? Church records might help, but where and which denomination? For what it's worth, his children were Methodist. His wife was Elizabeth (died 1884), who I believe was a daughter of Henry McLorinan, a farmer, who died at Castle Street Antrim in 1875, in the presence of someone who was almost certainly this John McDowell, living on High Street. So perhaps they married in Antrim town, but again which denomination? Does anyone know anything about any of this?

Offline shanreagh

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 09:58 BST (UK) »
Is this the family tree from Family Search? 
https://www.familysearch.org/search/linker?ark=/ark:/61903/1:1:FTW5-Q3X&id=GCGJ-PPQ&hinting=/tree/person/details/

If you are reasonably sure of the these names (for the children) have you looked at a way of finding the parents of john by looking at the traditional  Irish naming patterns

A traditional naming pattern was often used by Irish parents until the later 19th century:

First son usually named for the father's father
Second son usually named for the mother's father
Third son usually named for the father
Fourth son usually named for the father's eldest brother
Fifth son usually named for the mother's eldest brother
First daughter usually named for the mother's mother
Second daughter usually named for the father's mother
Third daughter usually named for the mother
Fourth daughter usually named for the mother's eldest sister
Fifth daughter usually named for the father's eldest sister.

The Irish did not usually adopt this practice as closely as the Scots but it may give some clues.....you can see the McLorinan names on this list.

Unless you know from the side of the family I think a name for John's father could be Thomas and possibly the Parker may be his father's mother's maiden name or his mother's maiden name...or it could be neither but the the name of a well regarded clergy man (as one of my ancestors second name was) or, or......

Offline aghadowey

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 11:47 BST (UK) »
I would like to find out about the family he came from. I imagine he was a younger son of a farmer, and because the family farm wasn't for him he made his living in the town (at one point as a sewed muslin agent, later as a commission agent). But which family and where? There seem to have been McDowells all around Antrim. ...

What basis is there for thinking he was "a younger son of a farmer"? Family stories or other sources?

In Ulster it was NOT always the eldest son who inherited a family farm. Often during the 1800s the elder sons left home looking for work and it might be the youngest, or one of the younger ones, who stayed at home.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline rathmore

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 12:40 BST (UK) »
Have a look on church records

http://www.irishgenealogy.ie

a John McDowell died in 1866 at newphew house 138 Corporation street Antrim aged 63


Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 13:26 BST (UK) »

a John McDowell died in 1866 at newphew house 138 Corporation street Antrim aged 63

This is him (and transcribed as MDOWELL).
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1886/06235/4784715.pdf


Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo

Offline jnomad

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 14:23 BST (UK) »
Thank you, all.

Yes, shanreagh, that's the family. (There are more sources on ancestry.com.) And yes, kiltaglassan, that death record is his. (There is also a death notice in the Belfast News-Letter, which led to finding his grave; thanks, Elwyn Soutter.) I can't find your 1866 death, rathmore; and anyway, how would it help? Clearly a different John McDowell.

The naming pattern is interesting. I'm pretty sure of those children. The birth dates for the sons are extrapolated from their declared ages at the 1901 and 1911 censuses; for the daughters from death dates and ages given on John's gravestone. For what it's worth, the second known son, Henry McLorinan McDowell, was named for his mother's father, as per the pattern. But it was Henry McLorinan McD's first known son, Samuel McMillan McDowell, who was named for his mother's father; second son, John, perhaps for his father's father; and then third son, another Henry McLorinan, for his father. So first and second in the pattern are flipped.

I had seen something like that pattern on irelandxo.com, and wondered about Thomas as the name of John's father, but haven't come up with a suitable candidate.

Younger son was just an ignorant guess, aghadowey; it's interesting that it could just as well be elder sons who made their living in the town. What I suppose goes on being likely is that John's parents were rural, though no doubt they may have already been townspeople. All I really meant is that the range of possible locations is quite extensive.

Offline jonwarrn

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 17:42 BST (UK) »
There is also a death notice in the Belfast News-Letter, which led to finding his grave

Also notices in the Belfast Telegraph, Northern Whig, Ballymena Advertiser
The Whig, 11 Dec 1886, report on the Antrim and Glenavy methodist circuit, says something about them sending a letter of sympathy to the family of the late Mr. John M'Dowell, Antrim, who had been for many years member of that Board.
Also mentions a T. M'Dowell as a circuit steward.

Offline jonwarrn

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 17:42 BST (UK) »
Is this the family tree from Family Search? 
https://www.familysearch.org/search/linker?ark=/ark:/61903/1:1:FTW5-Q3X&id=GCGJ-PPQ&hinting=/tree/person/details/

No daughter Lizzie/Eliza/Elizabeth on there. Nor on ancestry trees?
Marriage of Lizzie M'Dowell to Joseph Stewart, 11 Nov 1874, Methodist Chapel, Antrim
Father John M'Dowell, Manufacturing Agent
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1874/11249/8125564.pdf

Among others, birth of daughter Elizabeth McDowell Stewart in High Street, Antrim, 1877. Informant is John McDowell, Occupier
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1877/03026/2108699.pdf

Offline jnomad

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Re: John McDowell born 5 May 1817 died in Antrim town 29 November 1886
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 01 September 21 18:50 BST (UK) »
Thank you, jonw. Lizzie is new to me, and she certainly looks like another daughter.

T. M'Dowell may be John's son Thomas Parker McDowell.