Can't find people on Marriage Certificate

[Yashca]

Here is the entire certificate, hopefully it helps.

http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo292/Yashca/JohnLetitia.jpg

I will have a look at those websites you gave me.

[danuslave]

I would say John is 28 from this, but it certainly isn't easy to read

I've found a couple of John / Samuel combinations but neither looks all that promising

1851 census HO107; Piece: 2161; Folio: 79; Page: 30

Samuel Harding 39  silk weaver
Lydia Harding  38
John Harding  10

in Macclesfield, Cheshire

By 1861 John is also a silk weaver

Also 1851 HO107; Piece: 2091; Folio: 614; Page: 17

Samuel Harding  49  Ag Lab
Ann Harding  29 wife
John Harding  9
Samuel Harding  7
Eliza Harding  4

in Waltham On The Wolds, Leicestershire

By 1861 Ann is described as Married and a Groom's wife (Samuel isn't with the rest of the family) and John is an Ag Lab

Not a builder amongst them and no sign of Frances Mary!

Rather you than me

Linda

[Yashca]

Thank you for your efforts, I suppose either record could apply, assuming that John changed career sometime before 1869. The lack of a Frances Mary is a concern though, though if she is an auntie she may live away from the main family. I have no idea where else to look to try and resolve this.

I looked at the websites you gave me, they seem to indicate that I could try the Army Lists at the Public Records Office at Kew. This is certainly an option, but living as far away as I do, and my student finances limit me severely. It may be that I have to wait a few years before continuing with my research.
 

[josey]

I have found a family with father Samuel labourer aged 44, mother Faith aged 43, son John aged 15, daughter Frances aged 8 & son William aged 4 in Spillers lane Exeter on the 1851 census HO/107/1868/163.

From freebmd, Frances was Frances Mary, regd 1843 Q2 Exeter 10 - 98.

Could be them? John may have lied about his age...

If he enlisted at age 18, he would have been in the army by the 1861 census. Where were the 19th then?

Josey

[josey]

In 1861 this same family are still in Spillers Lane RG 9/1393/72
Samuel aged 54 now a plasterer [so could have become a builder by 1869]. Faith aged 54, Rosanna [daughter or daughter in law?] aged 30, illegible named son aged 15, Samuel aged 5, George aged 1 [possibly Rosanna's children?]

Josey

[danuslave]

Well done josey - they eluded me completely!

Linda

[Yashca]

That is amazing josey. We have a Samuel Harding as the father, a Frances Mary Harding in the close family, and a son, John, who is just about the right age.

If he was 15 in 1851, then he would have been 33 in 1869, the year he was married and said he was (possibly) 28. Five year difference? Do you think it possible?

Actually after looking at the actual 1851 record, I think there is a chance that the age might even be 13, but I can't be completely sure. If it was though, then he would have only been 31 when married, a more possible 3 year difference.

What would I need to prove this as being the right family. It seems very likely indeed, three family members tallying up, and John disappearing by 1861 (In the Army?)

Unfortunately I don't know much about the 19th Regiment and where they would have been at this time. Do entire Regiments stay together? Where can I find out more?

Once again, thanks josey. You have made my day.

[josey]

I can see a trailing top to the second digit in John's age on the 1851 census - I'm sure it says 15; however that may have been an error - deliberate or just an estimate. Looking at freebmd for the birth of a John Harding in Coldridge I can find Barnstaple Sep 1838 10-37, Sep 1839 10-38, Sep 1841 10-39, & 1 registered Tiverton Sep 1843 10 -249. My knowledge of Devon geography is not good enough to know where a Coldridge birth would be registered!! I have no doubt, from previous experience, that people were able to lie by 5 years or so at marriage - he may have lied at army enlistment although men ususally added to their ages, not take it away!!! - so had to keep up the pretence. How old was he said to be when he died?

I cannot find a marriage of a Faith to a Samuel Harding on freebmd Sep 1837 onwards, but they probably married before then. I couldn't find it on Pallot either [on ancestry] but that may not be comprehensive. I suggest you try an Online Parish Clerk for Devon [find them by googling]; these are wonderful volunteers, and even if records are not available online, the OPC will look records up for you.

As far as the whereabouts of the 19th - there is a very good Armed Forces board on this site; also a yahoo group 'britregiments' both full of knowledgeable & helpful people [britregiments is not for genealogical queries, but they will help will regimental movements and resources].

Unfortunately as John died in service, I don't think [although perhaps someone can correct me] that his military record will be at the Public Record Office at Kew. But if you could get hold of that, it would help greatly to tie your information together. I read that the Green Howards enlisted much in Yorkshire, but I am sure roving enlistment sergeants would have got all over England.

Hope this helps, Josey

[Yashca]

I've managed to find the marriage record for Samuel and Faith, 1832 Coldridge. Faith's maiden name is 'Palmer'.

I've also found John's birth, definately 1835, Coldridge.

It still niggles at me the discrepancy in his age, but other than that these records seem to fit so well.

Going to go ask some questions in the Armed Forces board, cheers once again.