Drayton? in Middlesex?

[findem]

"I found 8 children for Daniel Hill and Charlotte Webb with the help of GRO. Begins in 1815 with Henry".

Hi Doug, is the mention of GRO a deliberate mistake on your part to see if we are properly awake?   

[DougTCanada]

Do a search on FamilySearch for the last name "Hill", born in "Chelsea" between 1810 and 1840 with the mother's name "Charlotte" and you will see all of the most likely correct children and their christening dates. When you then check GRO for the later born children you see the the Mother's maiden name was "Webb".

[findem]

Do a search on FamilySearch for the last name "Hill", born in "Chelsea" between 1810 and 1840 with the mother's name "Charlotte" and you will see all of the most likely correct children and their christening dates. When you then check GRO for the later born children you see the the Mother's maiden name was "Webb".

I see, already done that on Family Search, haven't got round to Free Reg yet.

I'm pretty sure I've found the baptism of Charlotte Webb, in the 1851 Census it has her place of birth as London, the one I found fits the bill very well, bit more work to do proving it though, like did she marry or die where she was baptised.

Daniel Hill in the same Census claims Hillingdon as his birthplace but I've failed so far to locate him.

With the work I did yesterday I'm quite convinced now that Charlotte Webb is my wife's ancestor, not Charlotte Louisa Russell as I thought.  The thought struck me yesterday that the person who recorded the baptisms in the PR might have added the middle name of Charlotte Louisa Russell to distinguish the Hammersmith children Frederick 1815 and Louisa 1819 from those of Daniel Hill and Charlotte Webb, I'm pretty sure that Harriett baptised 1813 at Hammersmith belongs to Daniel Hill and Charlotte Webb.  Time will tell!

[trish1120]

I must admit I have only read over this new info quickly but just want to ask a couple of questions;

Do the 2 Daniels have different occp's?
When your direct Ancestor, child of Daniel Hill married if after Sept 1837, what was their Fathers occp?

[findem]

Hi Trish,

When Thomas Hastings (bachelor) married Caroline Read (widow) nee Hill, her father Daniel was a Labourer, as was the father of Thomas, Jonathon Hastings, the couple married 21 Apr 1862 at St Barnabas, Parish of St Luke, Middlesex by banns.  The marriage entry gives the address for both as 11 Garden Row, neither of the two witnesses had Hastings or Hill as a surname.

A few days ago I thought I had found the baptisms of both Daniel Hill and his wife Charlotte Webb but they fizzled out.

I spent part of yesterday going over stuff I had including Censuses,

1851 Daniel aged 60 born Hillingdon, therefore born about 1791.
1861 Daniel aged 70 and born Hammersmith.

1851 Charlotte aged 55 and born London, therefore born about 1796.
1861 Charlotte aged 65 and born Hillingdon.

So that couple although hazy about where they were born, at least they were consistent about their year of birth.  In both years Daniel was a Labourer and Charlotte had Laundry down as an occupation in the 1861 Census.

I have Daniels occupation at the time of his children's baptisms but I I have to go now something has cropped up so later I'll put them up.

[findem]

Here are the children of Daniel Hill and Charlotte Webb, also children of Daniel Hill and Charlotte Louisa Russell.
In the order of year of Baptism, child's 1st name, father's occupation and address at the time of the baptism.

1813 Harriett , a Taylor, Hammersmith.
1815 Frederick, a Taylor, Hammersmith.
1819 Louisa, a Taylor, Hammersmith.
1824 Charlotte, a Labourer, Hillingdon
1825 Henry, a Labourer, Poorhouse, Chelsea. Born 1815.
1825 John , a Labourer, Poorhouse, Chelsea. Born 1817.
1825 Daniel, a Labourer, Poorhouse, Chelsea. Born 1820.
1826 James, a Labourer, Hillingdon.
1828 Hannah Sarah, a Porter, Hillingdon. Born 1827.
1828 Eliza , a Labourer, Hillingdon. Born 1828.
1830 Caroline Hannah, a Labourer, Chelsea.
1832 Elizabeth, a Labourer, Chelsea.
1834 Jane Elizabeth, a Labourer, Chelsea. Born 1834.
1834 Ellen, a Labourer, Northolt, year of birth not given.

Only Frederick and Louisa's baptism entries named the mother as Charlotte Louisa, for the rest the mother was just named Charlotte.

I have put the children in year of baptism order because I think that way it gives clues as to who is whose child, wish I had done that before    .  On my Family Group sheets they appear in year of birth order, I do have birth dates for all the children except Ellen.

Hope the above info helps rather than hinder.

[DougTCanada]

My thinking is that the first four on your list - Harriett, Frederick, Louisa, and Charlotte all  belong to Daniel and Charlotte Louisa and they were all baptized in Hammersmith.

Henry,  John, and Daniel were all baptized on Feb. 2, 1821 in Chelsea according to FamilySearch as if the family had joined the church in Chelsea just recently. They are followed by Eliza in 1828, Caroline Hannah in 1830, Elizabeth in 1832 (died 1834), Jane Elizabeth in 1834. These are most likely all siblings wouldn't you say?

There is also another Elizabeth born in 1839 in Uxbridge with "Webb" as the mother. I do not have a christening date or place for her. Do you?

[DougTCanada]

OK, I am confused as all heck now

"New" theory... actually one I discarded previously but am attempting to resurrect it.   On the 1841 Census in St. Luke Chelsea there is a "Hill" family recorded in an institution. A poorhouse I presume. What throws me off is that there is Daniel Hill age 50, Harriett Hill age 45, then Charlotte Hill age 15, followed by a bunch of Hill kids the same name and ages as ones I presumed to be correct as Caroline's siblings. I am going to say that in the transcription or maybe even on the actual census Harriett's and Charlotte's ages were flipped.

Under that assumption that family I presume to be correct would have consisted of Daniel b. 1791 or 92. Charlotte b. 1796ish and their children:

All birth dates may be +/- 1 year in this list...

Henry 1815
John 1817
Daniel 1820
All above christened together and not on the 1841 census as they would have aged out. Depending on which is correct - an 1821 or 1825 christening date for those 3  -  there may or may not be a long gap before the next child "Harriett".

On the 1841 census are:
Harriett 1826
James 1827
Eliza 1828
Caroline 1830
Jane 1834
Sarah 1939

Not on the Census because she died in 1834 as Elizabeth born in 1832.
I still have another "Elizabeth" born in 1839 in Uxbridge with mother's name as Webb. Not sure what to make of her.

[familydar]

Forgive me if you've already covered this.  The 1839 child was born after civil reg started.  Is she showing on gro website and if so does mmn get you anywhere?