Name Change: Douglas to Drysdale

[skida]

russellynndrysdale: I hollered back on the PM (My Messages above).

PandaBud: I did find places called Johnstone Mills and Johnstone Bridge on the River Annan, but this seems a little outside of Dryfesdale. It does however confirm the name Johnstone in the larger area.

[PandaBud]

I was looking at mills on the Water of Milk that had sluice channels. At least one of them is a listed building, over 200 years old and may have been there longer. But that's making guesses, couldn't see or find anything definite. For Johnstones in the area look up the battle of Dryfe Sands. They were one of the big families in the region.

[gensearch]

Although indirect, perhaps there is evidence here which supports the connection that some Douglas family members adopted the Drysdale name on or about 1503, and there was an association with the geographical location Brushwood Haugh. There are a great number of Scottish place and family names which have been used in Johannesburg, South Africa. Apparently, one of Johannesburg's suburbs was named, Brushwood Haugh. Within this area are the roads Douglas and Drysdale, which intersect.

copyright image removed

[gensearch]

Here is the link to the map of Brushwood Haugh:

https://www.mapquest.com/south-africa/brushwood-haugh-ah-362983584

If you click on the plus sign 5 times to zoom in, you will see many uses of the names Douglas, Drysdale and Brushwood in this neighbourhood.

[Ronda231]

Hi all

I have a Scotlandspeople image for the Testament of one William Dryisdaill of Dollar dated 1600 which I have had professionally transcribed.

There are quite a few Drysdales mentioned in this Testament:

His children - William, Symon, Johne, Jonet, Ewffame, Agnes and Cristiane Dryisdaill.
Alexander Dryisdaill in Forrest, his brother, George Dryisdaill, portioner of Balhartie & Johne Dryisdaill his servant.

Full pdfs of the will (Scotlands People copyright) and its transcription are enclosed as attachments for any with an interest in Drysdale history.

Regards

[Ronda231]

James Drysdale, the trusted servant of William Douglas of Lochlevin

James Drysdale, who was in Lochleven Castle at the time Mary Queen of Scots was imprisoned there and who was singled out for harsh words in a letter by her in 1568/9 for saying he would like to put a sword to her heart*, had a life outside Lochleven Castle.

Source materials indicate that James was the father of  William Dryisdaill of Dollar, whose will dated 1600 is shown above.

Also, the 18-4-1565 birth record of one Kirsten Drysdeill, from the Scotlandspeople website, states:

"The 18th day James Drysdeill had a woman chyld born in fornication of Margaret Donaldson alias Whyt Wyndo baptizit and callit Kirsten." - Lochlevin in margin.

So it appears he was a bit of a rascal in his private life also!

*- Mary Queen of Scots - An examination of the letters, said to be written by Mary queen of Scots - Goodall 1754
- Life of Mary Queen of Scots, Volume 2 (of 2), by Henry Glassford Bell

A copy of the Scotlandspeople image of Kirsten's birth record is copied below:

[gensearch]

If we assume the story of the 3 Douglas brothers is true, that they changed their name to Drysdale which was already established in the area, what wouldn't change is their genetic marker, Douglas Y-DNA. Therefore, if a male today with the surname Drysdale took a Y-DNA test through Family Tree DNA but they were actually a descendant of one of the 3 Douglas brothers, they should get Y-DNA matches to people with the surname Douglas, and only Drysdales who were also in fact Douglas descendants.   

[Ronda231]

In my view the best critical analysis of the supposed Douglas - Drysdale name change in 1503 was written more than thirty years ago and this appeared in the February 1989 edition of The Clan Douglas Association of Australia Newsletter (copy attached).

One pertinent comment within this article "....If we could find Symon Drysdale of the 'Haugh of Dollar' this would indicate that he was the direct descendant of the three brothers, and therefore, provide some evidence to support the 1503 document...."

In a post above dated 11-8-23 (+ Testament) we can see that William Dryisdaill had a son named Symon who lived in Dollar and was alive in 1620.

Regards

[Ronda231]

One person who would have definitely known whether there was any truth in the 1503 Douglas-Drysdale document would have been James Drysdaill, the trusted servant of William Douglas of Lochleven (and Grandfather of Symon Dryisdaill of Dollar).

James could have passed on this family story directly to Symon (or via William Dryisdaill) and could possibly have embellished it somewhat in the passing or even made the whole thing up!!

By all accounts James was a bit of a rascal.

Regards