Author Topic: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby  (Read 121426 times)

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #144 on: Friday 26 August 16 23:01 BST (UK) »
...

Its obvious 1791 came from George Hood 5 year round off age.1841c but the 1845 death/burial year is interesting as Sherburn ? -You checked Cawood for a George burial 1845

Films and Fiche of Parish BURIALS checked, listed here ...

George Hood Burial where? ... Part 3
Page 27.
Reply 234
29 July 16
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=742806.234

Regards Mark

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #145 on: Saturday 27 August 16 18:42 BST (UK) »
...

Its obvious 1791 came from George Hood 5 year round off age.1841c but the 1845 death/burial year is interesting as Sherburn ? -You checked Cawood for a George burial 1845

Films and Fiche of Parish BURIALS checked, listed here ...

George Hood Burial where? ... Part 3
Page 27.
Reply 234
29 July 16
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=742806.234

Regards Mark

Posted the link for ref numbers as the Will is held at the NT Kew if you want the Will Bungle.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D453385
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Though I now think R Gibson brought George up as his mentor or master cooper maybe related, but it does not explain where George got is funding or wealth post 1812 as R Gibson was skint. (in fact R Gibson seems to vanish post 1813)

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #146 on: Sunday 28 August 16 08:57 BST (UK) »
...
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Though I now think R Gibson brought George up as his mentor or master cooper maybe related, but it does not explain where George got is funding or wealth post 1812 as R Gibson was skint. (in fact R Gibson seems to vanish post 1813)

In the Selby PR (birth of Thomas Gibson) of August 1793, the father of Richard Gibson, Cooper of Selby, is a Farmer, called Thomas Gibson of Newcastle. Later in 1800, Thomas Gibson is given as a Labourer, although I have seen someone being called both before. Labourers were not always poor either. Also I can't find anything suggesting Thomas Gibson, the Farmer got into any debt trouble, between the dates.

There are several debtors listed, that owe several Newcastle, Gibsons money.

Are you aware Thomas Gibson of Newcastle, BANKER had NINE illegitimate children!
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=80S8AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA55&lpg=PA55&dq=%22Thomas+gibson+of+Newcastle%22&source=bl&ots=oBDLWZ5zrp&sig=rMqG1nJMHjMlHtyk53514n7YP78&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwimmr7OtOPOAhXrCsAKHWQDCrIQ6AEIJjAF

Regarding Richard Gibson of Selby, a "Cooper", I have requested again (last week) copies of the records of those lodging the case / signing in, at the examinations, in June and July 1807.

This statement of calling yourself a 'Dealer and Chapman' was apparently in the main, to ensure that you were treated as a 'Trader' and therefore you could file for Bankruptcy.

The alternative, was to become 'insolvent' or an 'insolvent debtor' and risk spending the rest of your life in prison, or in prison until someone paid it off.

In Richard Gibson's case, Gazette 6 March 1810, unless anyone could show to the contrary, then Gibson's Certificate would be allowed. In the notice it also says it was a Commission of Bankrupt.

This 'Certificate' is likely referring to a 'Certificate of Conformity' it seems. If so, then there may be a reference in the Register. However, I noticed online that when there is no surviving Bankruptcy file (as in this case), there is little more in TNA, Kew, Registers and Indexes, than that, published in the London Gazettes  ??? ...

TNA B 6/15
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_st=adv&_col=0&_cr1=B%206%2F15&_dss=range&_sd=1810&_ed=1810&_ro=any&_hb=tna
TNA Note: Indexed
1810 Jan 4 - 1811 Apr 30

B 6/13 Registers of documents filed in Bankruptcy Proceedings 7 January 1807 - 27 August 1808
Indexed.

B 4/28 Registers of Commissions of bankruptcy
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_st=adv&_col=0&_cr1=B%204%2F28&_dss=range&_sd=1807&_ed=1808&_ro=any&_hb=tna
1806 Apr - 1808 Sept

Gibson and Gibson's Creditors to whom he owes money, have possibly come up with a plan at the 1807 Commission, which satisfied Gibson's Creditors and allowed his 'Certificate' by 1810.

Regards Mark

Offline Jomot

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #147 on: Sunday 28 August 16 11:46 BST (UK) »
I keep coming back to George Hood & Eleanor Wetherstone 15 Oct 1756, All Saints, so I'm just going to throw this out there....

1756 George Hood m Eleanor Wetherstone
1759 Joshua s/o George Hood
1764 Joshua s/o George Hood
1766 Caleb s/o George Hood
1767 Elizabeth d/o George Hood
1769 James s/o George Hood, Cordwainer
1770 Trinity House offers reward to seamen joining the Navy (must they already to be seamen?)
1771 George Hood aboard HMS Orford & writes will
1774 George Hood's will proved in London.  Sole executor is his wife, Eleanor
1775 Eleanor Hood, Widow, marries John Scott, Waterman
1779 Marriage of John Hood & Elizabeth Gibson (daughter of Thomas Gibson, Newcastle, sister of Richard Gibson of Selby). Bondsman is John Scott, Waterman.

1792 Marriage in Hull of James Hood & Ann Phillips
Baptism Tynemouth:
1795 James s/o James & Ann Hood of North Shore, Mariner
1798 Mary Ann d/o James Hood of North Shore, Mariner, native of All Saints by his wife Ann Phillips native of Hull
1800 Eleanor d/o James Hood & Ann Phillips – not in BTs
1802 George 2nd s/o James Hood of North Shore, Mariner Native of All Saints parish by his wife Ann Philips native of Hull.

My feeling is that this James Hood is a brother to John Hood, father of George Hood of Selby.   George in Selby names one of his daughters Ellen (after his grandmother, Eleanor?) and another James (after his Uncle?).

Unfortunately I haven't traced the family with any certainty after the 1802 baptism, but this is a possibility:

1803 (25 Dec) Burial Hull, Eleanor Hood d/o Ann
1803 (26 Dec) Burial Hull, George Hood s/o Ann
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.


Offline Jomot

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #148 on: Sunday 28 August 16 11:49 BST (UK) »
Here are the baptisms of Mary Ann & George Hood in Tynemouth:

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ic3/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ic4/
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.

Offline BushInn1746

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #149 on: Sunday 28 August 16 12:38 BST (UK) »
Hello All

Thanks Jomot.

I think, we'll have a look at all the docs in both the TNA, B (Bankrupts) and BT 98 Port of Registry: Shields and other Northern ports [these crew Muster Rolls include those from Newcastle and Gateshead per 'Seaweed'].

Be interesting to find John Hood, Mariner, around the time of his wedding to Elizabeth Gibson.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_st=adv&_ep=Shields&_col=0&_cr1=BT%2098&_dss=range&_sd=1778&_ed=1780&_ro=any&_hb=tna

Also:-
In B 5 Office of the Commissioners of Bankrupts and Court of Bankruptcy: Bankruptcy Enrolment Books 1807 (but no index til 1825, which is in B 8 after 1825).

B 7 Office of the Commissioners of Bankrupts, ... Minute Book 28 April 1807 - 29 April 1808, Note: Indexed

TNA guide says there may be a "minimal" amount of additional information, than that published in the L.G.

We strongly suspect that Gibson, is Hood's uncle and now there are Registers and Indexes, possibly with more info., than in the L.G., I must get copies, or see them.

Regards Mark

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #150 on: Sunday 28 August 16 14:53 BST (UK) »
Though its a good find ;) Thomas Gibson banker and his immoral pastimes with the ladies, I don't think he fits a vocation as a labourer or farmers life around Hall Gate Nuns/Town moor live stock feeding farming land fields.


I'll leave the bankrupt info searching to you Mark but what happened to Richard Gibson after 1810/11 is the big question  -Prison ?

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline dobfarm

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #151 on: Sunday 28 August 16 14:59 BST (UK) »
I keep coming back to George Hood & Eleanor Wetherstone 15 Oct 1756, All Saints, so I'm just going to throw this out there....

1756 George Hood m Eleanor Wetherstone
1759 Joshua s/o George Hood
1764 Joshua s/o George Hood
1766 Caleb s/o George Hood
1767 Elizabeth d/o George Hood
1769 James s/o George Hood, Cordwainer
1770 Trinity House offers reward to seamen joining the Navy (must they already to be seamen?)
1771 George Hood aboard HMS Orford & writes will
1774 George Hood's will proved in London.  Sole executor is his wife, Eleanor
1775 Eleanor Hood, Widow, marries John Scott, Waterman
1779 Marriage of John Hood & Elizabeth Gibson (daughter of Richard Gibson of Selby). Bondsman is John Scott, Waterman.

1792 Marriage in Hull of James Hood & Ann Phillips
Baptism Tynemouth:
1795 James s/o James & Ann Hood of North Shore, Mariner
1798 Mary Ann d/o James Hood of North Shore, Mariner, native of All Saints by his wife Ann Phillips native of Hull
1800 Eleanor d/o James Hood & Ann Phillips – not in BTs
1802 George 2nd s/o James Hood of North Shore, Mariner Native of All Saints parish by his wife Ann Philips native of Hull.

My feeling is that this James Hood is a brother to John Hood, father of George Hood of Selby.   George in Selby names one of his daughters Ellen (after his grandmother, Eleanor?) and another James (after his Uncle?).

Unfortunately I haven't traced the family with any certainty after the 1802 baptism, but this is a possibility:

1803 (25 Dec) Burial Hull, Eleanor Hood d/o Ann
1803 (26 Dec) Burial Hull, George Hood s/o Ann


Quote

1779 Marriage of John Hood & Elizabeth Gibson (daughter of Richard Gibson of Selby). Bondsman is John Scott, Waterman.


unquote

Should that not read

1779 Marriage of John Hood & Elizabeth Gibson (daughter Thomas Gibson Newcastle). Bondsman is John Scott, Waterman.



Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Any transcription of information does not identify or prove anything.
Intended as a Guide only in ancestry research.-It is up to the reader as to any Judgment of assessments of information given! to check from original sources.

In my opinion the marriage residence is not always the place of birth. Never forget Workhouse and overseers accounts records of birth

Offline Jomot

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Re: Richard Gibson married 1792 Selby- 1800 trade directory a Cooper Wren lane Selby
« Reply #152 on: Sunday 28 August 16 15:10 BST (UK) »
Quote
Should that not read

1779 Marriage of John Hood & Elizabeth Gibson (daughter Thomas Gibson Newcastle). Bondsman is John Scott, Waterman

Now amended to "daughter of Thomas Gibson, Newcastle, sister of Richard Gibson of Selby". 
MORGAN: Glamorgan, Durham, Ohio. DAVIS/DAVIES/DAVID: Glamorgan, Ohio.  GIBSON: Leicestershire, Durham, North Yorkshire.  RAIN/RAINE: Cumberland.  TAYLOR: North Yorks. BOURDAS: North Yorks. JEFFREYS: Worcestershire & Northumberland. FORBES: Berwickshire, CHEESMOND: Durham/Northumberland. WINTER: Durham/Northumberland. SNOWBALL: Durham.