California birthplace claim

[heywood]

It seems as though we may never solve the California situation.
I have been wondering about the properties that the family were living in.
In 1901 Robert , Eliza Jane and family are living in Lisdrumdoagh townland at house number 2.
If I am reading the records correctly, the house has 8 rooms. Robert is described as the head and the landholder.

1911, I think the house is occupied by Annie Beattie.
https://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Monaghan/Rackwallace/Lisdrumdoagh/807774/

Also in 1901, house number 1 is occupied by Edward and Sarah Jane Gillanders.
Edward Gillanders’ will was witnessed by a Robert Gillanders in 1899.
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01sy8/

I have previously followed occupation with land records and I was hoping to see either a Reid/Reed connection or an explanation re Robert Gillanders rise from labourer to farmer.

[Wexflyer]

I have been wondering about the properties that the family were living in.

One of the things that strikes me is that the three locations for the Gillanders family are all quite separate. In particular the two locations where Robert is stated to be a farmer (Fastry and Lisdrumdough) are very far apart. Living in 1st class houses in both, which is notable.  Grayglass (official Greaghglass) is separate again.

So we have a move from being a laborer in Greaghglass in 1876, to living in (presumably) a 1st class house, with farm in Lisdrumdoagh by 1886. Quite remarkable.

[aghadowey]

Farmers did move around at times, especially those with small parcels of land- usually to a better property. They might also inherit a property.

[heywood]

Farmers did move around at times, especially those with small parcels of land- usually to a better property. They might also inherit a property.

That was why I mentioned Land Registry to see f the property had been inherited from a Reid/Gillanders relative.

I think the Fastry property (Robert in 1911) was occupied by Robert Steen and his sister in 1901. They were born in Co Derry.
In 1911 they are living in Colerine - Adelaide Avenue.

[chempat]

Sorry that I have not replied to your continuing work.

I think I should not comment as Ireland seems to have different rules.

Fastry to Lisdrumdoagh is only about 20 miles - I have farming family move 90 miles at a similar time (Cheshire to Warwickshire).

I have just been looking at someone who was a railway clerk age 18, clerk at iron founders age 24, married age 31 as a gentleman of no occupation, and then is a Director of an iron founders age 34.  Social mobility happens.

[heywood]

https://archive.org/details/calendar3190607trinuoft/page/236/mode/1up?q=Gillenders

I think this means Robert acquired his diploma/degree in 1904 - name Gillenders - page 237

[aghadowey]

Fastry to Lisdrumdoagh is only about 20 miles - I have farming family move 90 miles at a similar time (Cheshire to Warwickshire).

20 miles is a fair distance in rural Ireland. My grandfather's uncle, writing about the family in the 1920s, mentioned his maternal grandparents lived a considerable distance away so they did not see them often - it was about 10 miles.

[Wexflyer]

Fastry to Lisdrumdoagh is only about 20 miles - I have farming family move 90 miles at a similar time (Cheshire to Warwickshire).

I have just been looking at someone who was a railway clerk age 18, clerk at iron founders age 24, married age 31 as a gentleman of no occupation, and then is a Director of an iron founders age 34.  Social mobility happens.

Fastry to Lisdrumdoagh is 31.7 km. A long way!

Sure, social mobility happens. But two moves, and laborer to gentleman farmer? That is what fascinates me about this case.

[Wexflyer]

Farmers did move around at times, especially those with small parcels of land- usually to a better property. They might also inherit a property.

Very true, which is why I took a look at the houses and properties.

The Edward Gillanders in Lisdrumdoagh, a neighbor of Robert's in 1901, "married in" there.
His wife was a Boyd, from there, and their house and farm can be seen on the 1860 Griffith's Valuation.
The three 2nd class houses in the townland on the 1901 census can all be reasonably identified with the top three houses rated at 1-10-0 on Griffiths.
This means that the 1st class house occupied by Robert Gillanders in 1901 seems to have been built post 1860.

The house that Robert was inhabiting in Fastry in 1911 appears with some certainty to be the one valued at 10-0-0 in 1860, by far the best in the townland. The farm was 90+ acres, with more held by others of same family.  That house/farm was indeed appropriate for a gentleman farmer, so that assertion appears to be true.

I checked bothe the Will & Admon calendars, and the Will registers. No sign of any inheritance in favor of Robert. No prior Gallanders or Reid/Reed landholding in Fastry or Lisdrumdoagh.